Dr. Connie Omari
Hey, hey hey, welcome to the black Marriage and Family Therapy matters podcast where we connect black families to black therapist. Today’s guest is Mrs. Tashayla Williams.
Hi Tashayla.
Tashayla Williams
Hi, how are you Dr. Omari?
Dr. Connie Omari
I’m good. How are you?
Tashayla Williams
Great. Thank you so much for having me.
Dr. Connie Omari
You’re very welcome. Let me tell our audience a little bit about you. To Shayla Williams is from Washington DC but currently resides in New York to Shayla Williams is a nationally certified counselor and a licensed mental health counselor. She has a BA in criminal justice, a BA and so on sociology, and a master’s in mental health counseling. She is currently a PhD candidate for human services. So Shayla has worked with individuals with disabilities abused and neglected teenagers, individuals with alcohol and substance abuse issues, returning citizens, those who are incarcerated couples, individuals and groups. She is the founder of the offender to returning citizen, which is a transition program that utilizes that utilizes expressive art and music therapy, in a minimum to super maximum prison and the founder of minority minds Incorporated, where she has launched minority minds Academy as she provides courses for the community and mental health professionals. Additionally to Shayla is the author of broke entrepreneur, how to start a business with little to no money, lyrical reflections of childhood trauma, and a CBT workbook, which is 50 lyrical reflections of childhood trauma activities for adults. Wow to Shayla, that is an awesome introduction and biography. Can you fill in the gaps? And tell us a little bit more about how you got started in this?
Tashayla Williams
Yes, absolutely. Um, well, I’ll start from the beginning, I, as soon as I graduated with a bachelor’s, I knew I wanted to do substance abuse counseling. So I immediately got my trainee status, and I thought it was fun to get all these wonderful job opportunities. People wanted individuals with experience. So I was Indian, and I even had one interview where they told me you know, you look really good. Should you should you be great, but you look too much like them.
Dr. Connie Omari
Wow, are you serious?
Unknown Speaker
I was told that and so that, that kind of sticks in my mind because that just drove me more so I ended up taking good job doing case management and you know, group homes while I waited for an opportunity to do substance abuse counseling. Then finally I got my opportunity. And it was in a maximum security prison. I had never been in a prison before and I remember at least for the first two months, my husband was like, Are you sure you like it? Are you sure you want to get it as soon as I stepped in and I saw faces that look like me so I saw faces that look like this I could have been my brother. And everything in there, I belong there. Where I thought, like, wow, I’m being discriminated against. And oh, this is horrible. I needed to hear that to drive me to be to that point. I’m sorry.
Dr. Connie Omari
No, I just want to say that that’s that’s awesome insight. Because I know a lot of times it’s easy to have a stigma more or less about the prison population. And it’s refreshing to hear that you have a passion and also you’re breaking some of that stigma. Good job.
Unknown Speaker
Absolutely, yes, I definitely. The prison population actually helped me to hone in on my purpose. In substance abuse counseling, I found that a lot of the issues with substance abuse counseling was untreated mental health disorders. entered my master’s program while I was there, and I stayed in the prison system for some years throughout my master’s program. And as soon as I graduated, it was my final semester, I ended up taking a course just to fill an elective. And it was a professor who she went around asking people, okay, when you’re, when you have trauma, when you have pain, what do you do? So, myself and another students, so we listened to music, and they said, Well, she said, Well, thing, your favorite song? What song would you listen to? And one of the students said, I’m Beyonce, I am here. So Oh, I love that song. She said, sing it. So we just looked at each other. And we were like, Okay, we’re in class, and you want us to sing. So we sung the song. She said, How did you feel in that moment? So we began, how we were filling in the moment. He said, so when you’re experiencing trauma, inducing fear, if you sing that song, when my son, like, she just helped us, like, process it. And then she was like, welcome to Music Therapy. Wow,
Dr. Connie Omari
I love that.
Unknown Speaker
It blew my mind, because that’s the type of therapy I wanted.
Dr. Connie Omari
Absolutely.
Unknown Speaker
Yeah. And I was I was automatically thinking about just us as black people, African Americans, with the stigma of mental health, what will we gravitate to? And if somebody presented to me in that way, I would be there. However, if someone said, come sit on my couch tissue, right? Maybe maybe not. So Right. So. So from there, I found my purpose. Very
Dr. Connie Omari
good. So let me I don’t want to cut you. But I just want to reiterate what you said. So you’re saying that you can actually, you know, a lot of our culture is known for the way that we sing and dance and just the expressive arts. But you’re saying that there is a therapeutic value to that? Absolutely. Very good. All right. Very good. I know, we’ve got some people who are going to appreciate hearing that awesome.
Definitely, definitely. So yeah, so from there, I, as soon as I graduated, literally, the week after I graduated, I got my LLC. In this way, I knew I wanted to start a business, I started writing a curriculum to implement art and music therapy in the prison system. And so I had never written a grant in my life, I started Googling million dollar grants, I knew I wasn’t getting the million dollars, but I want to know what it looked like what it sound like to have a million dollar grant. So this was, you know, in for those you are unfamiliar with when you are working towards licensure, they don’t tell you there’s a period where you may have I had to start working at a point in order to get my clinical hours. So I had to have the conversation with my husband, like, Hey, I can’t work for a little bit. I have to get these hours, but it’s going to be worth right. And so now I’m saying, I’m going to start a business. I know we don’t have the money, but it’s going to happen. Wow.
Unknown Speaker
So I wrote this grant. It was July 2014. had never written the grant. And then in August, actually September 1, sorry, September 1 2014, I received an email that was Margot giving me a check for 30,000 to start.
Dr. Connie Omari
Oh, wow. Wow. Congratulations.
Unknown Speaker
Thank you. Thank you. So it was it was it was really excited because you know, to have a thought and have somebody understand, you know, how it’s going to be put into practice is based off of your words.
Dr. Connie Omari
Was he especially because of what you were trying to do and so one of the things that I hope our audience can take from this is a lot of times, you know, we hear about entrepreneurship and businesses and things like that. A lot of times we don’t think about the value of that in our community. And, and when we’re doing things like getting grants and things like that. A lot of times, we just don’t think about how thinking that it can be for us. So the fact that you’re out here and do you do you go over that in any of your materials that I introduced earlier?
Unknown Speaker
Um, yes, I’m actually I’m, as we get to talking about the academy. You mean, do I go over like how to get like grants and stuff like that, sir?
Dr. Connie Omari
Do you have any resources or anything for us? Our audience? Okay, we’ll get to it. We’ll get. Yeah, well, why don’t we just go ahead and jump into that? Is that okay?
Unknown Speaker
Yes, not a problem. So I have minority mines Academy. There, you can go online. And I wanted to give people a step by step guide, because a lot of what I experienced was like trial by fire. And not really having someone to ask about how do you do a Schedule C? How do you start an LLC? How do I make sure I’m buying off the right things? How do you write a grant who’s eligible for grant? So I do have a course on my business one on one tells you about the difference between an LLC and a nonprofit and the fruits of it literally tells you step by step from the from the point of conception of having the idea, business plan, if you need it, a lot of times people think you need to have a business plan. And I have to be honest, I have run several businesses. I have never written a business. Wow. Wow. The the plan, I guess was internal. Right?
Dr. Connie Omari
You knew the plan, and it was in your head? Yes.
Unknown Speaker
So we do offer a free business template just to get your ideas going. But I tell you step by step how to run a business, that course is $75. And let’s say that you decide that you want to write a grant proposal, you don’t count. We also have a grant writing course, which is 199, inclusive, free consultation with me, but tells you step by step. Like I said, from the point of IDEA conception to. And the course it may seem expensive, because I’m a broke entrepreneur. So I’m all about you know, making something worth your while. pores. Just think about it in this way. You pay 189 for the force and the tools that I gave you, you can write a million dollar proposal and possibly get a million dollar coat. So we think about it in those terms. It’s really not a lot. So it’s not literally step by step. Yep. So those those are available on the website, www dot minority minds dot
Dr. Connie Omari
we’re okay. And I’ll put that out. So you don’t you don’t have to? Yeah, that’d be available. Yeah. Yeah. Good, good.
Unknown Speaker
Its available I want to access then to understand, you know, they always say it takes money to make money. It does. But it doesn’t have to be your money.
Dr. Connie Omari
That’s good. Very good. All right. Well, let’s go into some of the things that we wanted to talk about. So at the time of this recording, and I don’t mind sharing, we just getting the news about breonna. Taylor, but 2020 has been a year of just some very. Are you still there? Yes. I’m still here. Yes. Okay. We’ll edit some of that out. Okay. The year of 2020 has been a big, I guess, has been a lot going on with respect to black lives and the value of of our life and just the trauma that I think a lot of us have under gone as it relates to being black and being constantly reminded that our lives are not as important. What do you wish black families knew about that? So I want
Unknown Speaker
I think we take a variety of approaches. We either take the approach of well, we knew this was going to happen anyway. Or we just become numb to it and we don’t say anything. So the course that I created, it’s a free course it will remain free because I want people to access it and to understand that you have to be strategic about how we support each other how we heal, and we have to keep discussing and keep talking we can not say anything because not saying anything is saying a lot. Absolutely. I want us to do We get together with our family. And even though we all may be feeling the same way, and we know we’re feeling the same way, and I say anything having having a sit down and say, You know what, I know, I probably had a discussion with you about, you know, sitting in the car and putting your hands on the steering wheel when you get pulled over. But this is where this young lady was sleeping. How do you how do you prepare for that? Yes. So I think that we have to do is pivot and make a shift in this increase in feelings of self worth, increases, of love to say that we do not know what life holds just in general as human beings, but to live our life center portfolios, to love those who you know, are closest to us, and understand that, you know, those people are going to be held accountable, you know, whether you have a spiritual connection or not. For me and my family, you know, I have to put it in God’s hands, because the only way that makes sense. For you know, other people may, it may be a little bit more difficult, but to find understanding, and the fact that none of this is our fault, we have to discuss it, there’s no way to prepare for this. The fact that you have to prepare for you know, stops or even interactions will lead to terrible, but there’s no way to prepare for being sleeping in your bed and being attacked.
Dr. Connie Omari
Absolutely. Where do you see black families struggling when? You know, they know that, like you said at the beginning with the prison system like this could be your husband, this could be your son or your daughter. Now as Briana has shown us, like, where are we struggling as a as a people?
Unknown Speaker
I think I think we struggle with just staying connected. In the prison with both men and women, I have to say, you know, in a part of my story is he eventually transitioned into Rikers Island. I know a lot of us are familiar with Rikers Island. I’ll just give you a picture of visiting day. On Vincent day for the males, there 1000s of visitors, they bless them in almost like a rite of passage to a middle family member be incarcerated, or you go and visit them on Saturday, you make sure. And we just kind of know, this is just how the system you know, works. Women. I cannot. I can maybe count. I worked on Rikers Island for almost four years. I can maybe count on one hand, how many times I saw visitors who went.
Dr. Connie Omari
Wow. Wow.
Unknown Speaker
So I think that, number one, we have to stick together in terms of understanding our rights and justice. That role, and I worked with 18 to 21 year olds on Rikers Island, individual plea because they were tired of sitting for three and four years waiting for court dates. I think that we have to start educating just like we educate our ABCs educating about our rights, our responsibilities, I think that, you know, we need to be more in tune with the law, being connected, having a lawyer just as important as having a PCP for us. Yeah, because there’s lots of things that we do not know, and that a lot of us are in there simply because of that. So I think we fall short in the area of just like not having the knowledge and not staying connected with each other. And I’m accepting the history that they’ve created for us, and incarceration. And that’s not what we represent.
Dr. Connie Omari
What advice would you give our listeners who continuously feel hopeless about what we’re seeing in our community and the police?
Unknown Speaker
I would say to find fun a way for you to connect with the situation in a healthy manner. I know that for example, when they began protesting for George Floyd and breonna Taylor Taylor, and it was in the midst of COVID. I’m very active, I’m from DC. So if something occurs, you go to the White House you march you buy it, like that’s just a part of what you do. However, with COVID in living in New York, and before COVID, Medora and COVID, I actually experienced pneumonia, I didn’t get COVID. But of course had to, like watch out for like health stuff, I found myself feeling defeated and feeling hopeless, because it’s like, I know what I would do. But, you know, I, you know, I feel kind of stuck, because I don’t want to put myself at risk, but I want to contribute to this cause. So I would say, find a way for you to contribute to the narrative of hope and healing. What I do was, I created music therapy Mondays. We were watching and writing, um, you know, I was able to have local artists Come on, sing songs of hope, you know, encouragement, and then related to mental health and give people the options they were feeling in the moment. And for me, that was my contribution. And I posted it on social media. So that was my contribution to the world. And it made me feel like I wasn’t defeated. So for the person who feels hopeless, I will say, find what that thing is for you to contribute to the situation, because there’s always something whether, whether small, whether it’s, in my mind, I was like, Well, I’m just going to stand on my sidewalk, and, you know, hold the sign. And, you know, maybe that would, for me, that wasn’t enough. But I eventually I did get a chance to drive home and I saw there was no one in the street. So I was able to, you know, kind of, kind of be a part of it. But to find what that thing is for you, I would say to contribute. But the thing I would say to not do is not don’t do nothing. So even if it’s I need to write down my feelings in the moment. Last night, I just had a session where I just listened to music all night, because that was my way into. So whatever it is, whatever that thing is for you find it, find something new, but don’t do nothing.
Dr. Connie Omari
Very good. I like that. I like that. So what are you know, you said find something to do? Don’t do nothing? I guess that goes into our my next question. Because, you know, can you give people resources, like 123 resources that they could rely on to do something because a lot of times, we know that we’re hurting? And I mean, like this issue, we did do something, we protested. We wore shirts we donated, we did everything. And still, there was nothing. Yeah, what are some mental? You mentioned the music thing. Let’s talk about can we talk a little bit more about that resource? Because I think a lot of people, a lot of people, of course, listen to music, they see music, they make music, but they don’t really realize that it that is therapeutic. So can we start with that resource, and maybe you can add to that? Yep.
Unknown Speaker
So in our free course that we have online, I provide six different activities for families, for individuals to do, you can do it with yourself, your friends, or your family. One of those activities is to create a crisis playlist. So the crisis playlist is an I recommend you do this not during the crisis. But prior to the crisis. What are some songs, it doesn’t matter what mood I’m in, puts me in a good mood. So let’s say you have your mother, the mother, the father, son, daughter, everybody puts together a list. So in that moment, let’s say, we just found out a new Breanna Taylor. So mom, then put speaker on place to crisis playlist, not only communicate, remember, we sat down and we did this together, I want you to feel happy, we’re going to have a discussion. But in this moment, I need to provide some non verbal communication to you that we’re in this together. So I also provide my personal playlist, some of my personal playlists as a part of the authority conflict, trauma course. So I say you can use these playlists, you know, or create your own among the family. I do recommend Creek, you know, among the family, because the the activity itself, just you know, it just provides a memory and a reminder of, you know, what you guys created together and to communicate what you’re trying to do in that moment. So, that’s one of the things yes,
Dr. Connie Omari
I like that. Well, it’s actually two things because it sounds like you’re talking about your course. Sounds like you’re talking about music therapy. And so I think those are really, really great resources for our audience. Thank you for that. Uh huh. Is there a common myth or narrative or limiting belief that you’d like to dispute for us that that you feel that we’re telling ourselves? Okay.
Unknown Speaker
We’re telling ourselves that I don’t want to go to therapy, because I don’t want people all in my business. And I think that that’s something that has hurt the black community for so long. Dan ended, because we have experienced cattiness people talking behind your back, you tell a friend a secret. And then, you know, next thing you know, everyone else knows about it, or you tell a family member or something, and then the whole family knows and calling you and telling you about your business. I think we should educate ourselves about what it means to have a therapist. And what that means is you get someone who is not only bound to ethical obligations. But specifically, you know, there is I’ve had the pleasure of encountering encountering so many wonderful, wonderful black therapists who are very passionate about making sure that we have the supports that we need. So these therapists, they, they take accountability, and they they really understand the need for someone to come in, be able to tell their problems, be able to develop a plan and be able to know that it doesn’t go anywhere. So I want us to know that it’s different than talking to your friend, it may be talking to your friend. But talking with a therapist, it’s not talking to your friend, it’s about writing something down in a human diary and going nowhere. Between them.
Dr. Connie Omari
Wow. That’s exactly right. That’s exactly how I would would describe therapy. All right, well, well, thank you. Thank you for your feedback. So now we’re in a point in the show that we call what’s good. And it’s part of the show where we apply information that you shared with us to our listeners in a hypothetical situation. Okay, are you ready? Okay. Me Tai Shan Shan is a 15 year old African American boy who is in high school. With all of the shootings of men who look like him black men who look like him, he is terrified that he may be in a situation where he might be confronted by the League by the police. He knows that his parents have taught him how to be respectful, and how to respond to a legal situation. But he’s still very much afraid to make matters worse with COVID-19. And stereotypes about black boys in general. He doesn’t feel supported by the school counselor. How would you advise Tai Shan to get help?
Unknown Speaker
This is interested in actually sounds very similar to one of the scenarios that we utilize in the course. And I would say, number one, in terms of Tai Shan it’s important for him to not do this alone. Oh, I think that he should, number one, inform his family. And I think the school counselor may be someone who’s comfortable. I think he should also, if he’s uncomfortable with the school counselor, I think he should speak with his family about seeking someone on the outside so that that person can advocate for him. Just going back to the minutes I think another myth is that, um, a lot of times people say they don’t like therapy because they had a bad therapy experience. People don’t realize that you can choose your therapist, you don’t have someone who makes you uncomfortable, who does not understand you, who does not connect with you have to have someone who can with you and understand you you feel comfortable with if he’s feeling uncomfortable. The school counselor and school counselors are kind of fixed. So it’s not like you can change them. I would suggest that maybe he seek therapy outside of that. That he’s able to process you know, it may it may be as simple as you know, there being a misunderstanding, but in this moment, I think that you know he should process that with someone on the outside and then we can do gravitates to understanding or exploring with his family, with the assistance of his new therapist about how to utilize the school therapist as an additional support. But I really feel like and we and we know you know, we know who we mesh well with and who we don’t even as children know to mess well with. And I think that a myth and something that you know, touch on should consider is acorn, someone who connects with him better.
Dr. Connie Omari
Very good. Very good. All right. Well, to Shayla, it’s been a pleasure interviewing you today. You certainly bring a wealth of knowledge I’ve certainly been inspired by your feedback today I’m certain our listeners will as well. I want to just make sure that you’ve given our audience enough information about where they can find you and how they connect with how they can connect with you online.
Unknown Speaker
Not a problem. We are on Instagram at minority mind our website is also WWW dot minority mindset work. My phone number is on there my emails whenever you can contact me directly. I usually respond fairly quickly. So definitely get in contact have any questions we feel like it’s something we need to add we definitely want to have things that are contributing to the community only one
Dr. Connie Omari
very good alright to Shayla, thank you very much. It’s been a pleasure meeting with you today. All right. You have an amazing day.
Tashayla Williams
You too. Thank you so much. You’re welcome.