Dr. Connie Omari
Hey, and welcome to the Black Marriage and Family Therapy Matters podcast, where we connect black families to black therapists. Today’s guest is Latasha Tony. Hi, Latasha. Good afternoon. How are you?
Tasha Toney, LCSW
I am wonderful. How about you?
Dr. Connie Omari
I am great. Great. If you don’t mind, I’d love to introduce you to our audience and let them know about the wonderful work that you’re doing. Is that okay?
Tasha Toney, LCSW
That is wonderful. That’s great.
Dr. Connie Omari
Perfect. Okay, let’s go, Harsha. Tony is a licensed independent clinical social worker who is passionate about the intersection of womanhood, mental health, and Christian faith. She is the host of mindful nuggets, where she has full conversations about those things. But Tasha enjoys encouraging others to take care of their mental health. She likes to spend time with those she loves and try new foods. Wow. Latasha, that is awesome. Just curious, what’s your favorite kind of food?
Tasha Toney, LCSW
I like Mexican food. I wish I had actually eaten some tortillas and salsa like four times ago. But Mexican seafood Those are my top favorites.
Dr. Connie Omari
We were both saying that I actually like seafood too. Awesome. Awesome. See, Phil gives you wisdom. Right? They say that about the brain.
Tasha Toney, LCSW
Okay, that is true. Yep.
Dr. Connie Omari
Awesome. Awesome. So tell me a little bit more about you specifically. I’m obviously more interested in your clinical practice. What got you into practicing, and how long have you been doing it?
Tasha Toney, LCSW
Well, my background is in social work; I actually decided in the 11th grade that I wanted to work in the field to help other people in the psychology course. And it was just so interesting to me that I could try to identify reasons for people’s behavior. So I actually went to college; I was going to major in psychology, but I did not like psychology. So I ended up changing my major a few times. And I ended up deciding on social work because, compared to the other fields of ethics, it was the only one that required me to have a license to be considered. You know, as a practitioner, I really like that. So when I was in graduate school and majored in social work, I decided I wanted to be a therapist a long time ago. But God took me on a different path to get to where I am now. So my very beginning work involves working with families and children, some who were in foster care and some who were in their natural home environments, and they were at risk of being removed from the environments. So I taught skills to kind of help stabilize the home environment. But I always felt like there was something missing from these people. I was going in to teach these skills that you have, and they were, you know, okay. They thrived on receiving those services. But others seem to just need more support. So I just realized that the missing link for that was therapy. But as time went on, I worked in a residential setting. And I did inpatient psychiatry for a long time, during which I learned a lot about mental health. While working in that field. Like I said, I had to go down certain paths to get to where I am. So working in inpatient psychiatry, I really enjoy helping clients get to a stable place. But again, I felt like they were missing this missing link, which was therapy. So I had the opportunity to work as a therapist in private practice in 2021. That was a very interesting experience. I can talk about that in different podcast episodes. But I started working for a different group practice last year, so I’ve been there for about a year. So while I’m relatively new to private practice, I’m not new to mental health. And I’ve just seen a lot of mental health issues in the lives of those around me, like family and friends. So I just think that God placed me here. So
Dr. Connie Omari
awesome. Awesome, awesome. Awesome. Well, that’s such good feedback. Because I think a lot of times we’ll talk to you, I’m interested in what you think about this. But when we find ourselves in situations that don’t seem ideal, like it’s not what we planned, I heard you say that you were going in a completely different direction. And all of a sudden you found yourself back here; it’s easy for us. Or it’s easy for a lot of people to say, Okay, well, this isn’t what I was expecting. This hasn’t happened the way I thought it was going to happen. I’m going, you know, something must be wrong, or I’m not in the right chair. Let me just give up. But it sounds like you kept going until you found what it was. Can you speak more? That journey in that process?
Tasha Toney, LCSW
Yeah, I actually think one thing that helped me was going to therapy myself. So back in 2011, we had this really horrible tornado hit Tuscaloosa, Alabama. And just like it wiped out much of Tuscaloosa, Alabama, it wiped out my old apartment complex. It also can’t be part of Birmingham. And I was just, like, a little traumatized by just seeing this on the screen. And I can remember talking to my manager to tell me, Oh, my gosh, I was just so overwhelmed by what I saw on the news last night. And she was like, Have you ever considered going to therapy? It’s like, it’s a route of her telling me that. You know, you are here to support me. But anyway, I’m glad that she told me that. So at that time, I was able to, you know, start seeing a therapist throughout the EAP service; I had six sessions with this therapist. But I hate to compare therapists. But of all the people who have seen her for therapy, she’s probably been the best therapist. So although we only met six times, it just really kind of helped to open my mind to what was possible for me. And, like, even I went to this church years ago because I was wanting to work on some personal things. And he offered a program there called Celebrate Recovery. That’s where it really opened my mind to the possibility that I could change. So that happened in 2010, I believe. And they just kind of showed me how I had concerns. He’s concerned about our hurts, hangups, and habits. So starting with that, in 2010, I actually started going to therapy in 2011. And I’ve been going to therapy off and on since then. But just seeing what was possible for me and just my different professionals, it’s been the ones who just took all of those things and helped others have a better quality of life. So I hope that answered your question.
Dr. Connie Omari
It’s because it does. I think as therapists, you know, when we’re able to admit that there were some we’d struggle with and we go through change and transition, I think it helps us be very relatable. Um, so I don’t know if this is worth even mentioning. But we’re the black marriage and family therapists. In this podcast, we obviously support and celebrate like families; we’re going to get into that. I just want to make a quick side note. I think this is important to add. But I know you might have heard my phone go off. But that was actually my alarm because my volume should be off. But it doesn’t affect my alarm. Sometimes. I pray for my husband at a certain time. In the 130s is the day that he’s born. So I just did a quick mental prayer in my head. But I have to remember what I told these little boys—not to have my phone beside me. But I just want to mention that because I know that you are also a faith-based therapist. And if I remember correctly, you don’t necessarily advertise faith-based services. Is that what you were saying?
Tasha Toney, LCSW
Well, okay, so I am a Christian who is trained to provide therapy from an evidence-based practice scientific background, but I’m a Christian; I did not go to seminary, so I’m not like a Christian counselor. But if I have a client who wants to talk about their faith and I bring that up in the session, I’m willing to go there. So
Dr. Connie Omari
I’m curious, you know, because even in the work that I do today, I’m not practicing right now. We talked a little bit about that earlier. Even for clients that don’t practice Christianity or any faith, do you just pray over your crap like, The guy will use you, and God will guide you to lead you, and you know, if, by chance, a client you know practices that, that’s okay, but that’s it. Guide, you know, do you ask God to help you connect with that client or be helpful to that client? Or favorite client?
Tasha Toney, LCSW
Yeah, I was just asked for insight and wisdom on how to interact with my clients. So
Dr. Connie Omari
Yeah, that’s good wisdom and insight. Yeah.
Tasha Toney, LCSW
I think there is much needed If I don’t have that, what am I doing?
Dr. Connie Omari
I find that I did my dissertation on neural attitudes and expectations between blacks and whites in America. And one of the things that I found was that, statistically, this is stuff that I think most of us already know: black families have higher marital success rates, are less likely to get married, and our white counterparts marry later, are more likely to get divorced, have more dissatisfaction in relationships, etc. But that’s a little bit of a contradiction in our faith, which, as Christians, you know, the Bible is very clear about marriage and the importance of it and the sanctity of it, etc. I’m just curious. Your thoughts with that, like, do you think I mean, to me, on the one hand, blacks are one of the most religious bodies of people in the world? Yet for some reason around this, and when I say religious, I’m talking about faith-based Christian faith, There’s a disconnect here. What do you think maybe some of that is? And then, you know, I did my research on this. I’m just curious. You know, I could add to it. But what,
Tasha Toney, LCSW
Yeah, so I agree, we are the most religious people, in the sense that we’ll get up and go to church on Sunday, might be at church on Wednesday, and other days throughout the week. So we were always on the go. But as far as you know, actually taking time to read the Bible, understand what it’s saying, and apply it to our lives I think that’s more of the spiritual part of, you know, our faith; we don’t really take time to tap into, you know, what the Bible says as to how you should live when you have these struggles, and how to, you know, really get God’s point of view about these things. I think there’s a difference between, you know, going to church and, you know, oh, you know, I’m going through this hard time right now, let me pray about this, but actually, allowing God to really just get every single area of your life, he’s like, we want to give him a certain party. No, we want to apply for a job. But we don’t want to ask Him for wisdom on how to keep that job. For marriage, but we don’t ask Him for wisdom on how to, you know, interact with our spouse in that marriage, or if you want to ask him for children. But we want to just kind of do what our mom and grandma did until something happens. And then we want to pray. And that’s kind of how to fix it. So it’s like, we want him to be like Santa Claus or Genie. But we don’t really want him to take Liqui’s heart to do that. But I think a lot of our religion is just traditional; we really haven’t taken the time to really understand what the Bible actually says. And, you know, how we are to conduct ourselves in light of that.
Dr. Connie Omari
You know, I have to agree with most of what you said, and I’m curious why. Why do you think that is? Because as I hear you speak, I can’t help but think about, for instance, and I don’t think I’ve ever talked about this on the podcast. But when I was going to post 12 or 13, I talked about being molested and stuff like that. I think when I was 13 or 12, I had to sign a covenant in my church that said that I wouldn’t have sex until marriage. And I knew that this thing had already happened to me. And at that point, well, I had told, but this was something the black family didn’t talk about, you know, so I guess I just say, you know, for me, that’s a message that, oh my god, like, I’m going to help, you know, because nobody ever told me that I was wrong before I realized that that wasn’t my fault as a child. Like I didn’t like carrying that. And so I was forced to sign this contract. So where do you think it is? I’m not. You know, I believe I want to say the pastor’s intention was to have meat. Although the typical principles are that the Bible is very clear about sex before marriage, do you think that the black church does a good job of addressing things like sexual assault or any type of sexual behavior? That isn’t completely monogamous between man and woman?
Tasha Toney, LCSW
No, thanks for the black chart. Well, I can’t speak for every single church. I do think there are some churches, you know, that have people who take time to provide information about those things. Yeah, we’re grateful for it; it was like I was actually able to be a part of a conference recently. And we talked about mental health; we had somebody talk about youth and mental health; we had somebody talk about older adults and mental health, like I just talked about adults and mental health. And I brought a faith-based perspective to accept that in a church, a lot of people have shame about things like what you mentioned, about, you know, being sexually abused, or just things they might have seen in their home environment. And we do need trauma-informed clergy; trauma-informed mental health clergy who are simply aware of what it looks like when someone has experienced trauma or has had an issue and know how to intervene. So I think there are a lot of programs out there. So those of us, you know, who are of their faith and have the background, you know, we’re going to want to seek an advocate these days. One thing I do like is that, right off the bat, we just talked about everything. And like, there’s this one verse that stands out to me, and it talks about speaking up for the needy. So I think that’s why I’m part of what we do as believers in this is to advocate for those people who are, you know, marginalized, you know, less fortunate, because, you know, we all have things that we go through, but, you know, I have things that I saw in my life, and I’m able to take all of those things and use them to, you know, enlighten other people and to hopefully, you know, help those who are coming behind me to not have to go through the same thing. So, my best reason for being so passionate about this is that I’ve been in the church myself. And people just kind of minimize my mental health. Things we like, I didn’t want to talk about them; if I did, they would shame me for expressing, Oh, I have anxiety. We don’t talk about those things. I really, really want to just throw a verse out there. So I think it’s just important that people know about, you know, what mental health is and how it relates to our faith, because sometimes a person’s, you know, understanding of who God is can lead to some mental health issues. So if you have these path terms, like, you know, you need to be a virgin when you get married, but you experienced sexual trauma, I could see how that could be a little confusing and maybe even keep you this connected, you know, from the church. But if we look through the Bible, we have a lot of people there who experienced a lot of hardships—you know, horrible things—and God met them in those places. So, you know, God is not ashamed of our struggles. And we, as you know, believe Russians shame other people for their struggles, too. So that was a long answer. But
Dr. Connie Omari
No, it was very, very informative. It was very informative. So I want to ask, and I guess I’ll just be very, very blunt about it. A lot of the things that you said, before I go to that, I really want to highlight were our personal responsibilities. Like it, read it. You know, one thing that has helped me over the years is understanding that I don’t, and this is for women; this is the Bible; your relationship with that with respect, education, your career, whatever, find it for yourself; don’t necessarily just take somebody’s word for it. So one of the things that TD Jakes always says—well, I’ve heard him say it a couple of times—is, you know, when we have church hurt, because that’s what this is called. We tend to say, Okay, well, I’m not going to church anymore, or I’m not going to read the Bible anymore. I’m not going forward with that, but if you go to work and you don’t like everything your boss says, you know, you probably miss it. When do they know, girl, you say an air? You don’t say, Um, so you know, there’s this issue with church. I think that we just look at it and say, Okay, because this happened to me, and I understand that this was a really horrible, horrible thing to go through. Where do we get to the place where we want to be personally responsible, take accountability, and separate the person that made me sign a covenant from the guy that says, I love you anyway; you know, I can help you screw that? I’ll support you through that. How do we get there?
Tasha Toney, LCSW
It takes some healing to get to that point. So there are a lot of therapists who specialize in spiritual trauma. So just having that validation and unpacking that story with a trained professional can help. And just because you go through something does not mean you have to share that with other people; not everybody is going to be a person to go out here. And, you know, start with me in movement. But God will bless those people’s hearts to go out there and share their message. So I think it just depends on your own, you know, personal experience and your conviction. You want to get your healing done first. And there are some people who actually get their healing from helping other people. So it’s just an individual experience. But as far as being able to identify, because I have, oh my gosh, yeah, I’ve had a little, I don’t want to talk bad about him. But I had a pastor growing up. I loved his wife; she was amazing. I’m not saying he was a horrible person, but she was just really, like, personal. If I saw her, you know, she was also like a firm. If I saw this man, he would barely know my name. And I was in this church for like, 18 years, even as an adult. But he barely knew who I was; he would call me my mom’s dark. Like, really, I’ve been here all my life, and you don’t know my name. So I just really felt a disconnection there. But now I have a pastor who’s very affirming. You met a pastor who was the pastor of that church; he’s just really personal. So it’s like, not everybody, you know, is like that pastor who you had. I think sometimes people go this way, like a whole other podcast episode, because you got a little time with it. But a lot of people go into the ministry for different reasons. Like there are people whose Daddy was a pastor. So because they’re that he’s getting older. He’s like, You know, only she can be the pastor now. And it’s like, this person wasn’t called by God to do this thing. Like, everybody cannot be a counselor; you know, a person who goes to school for counseling, you know, has all of these educations. And when they get into the field, they’re not fit to do this. So I don’t think that because a person is in a certain position that they’re supposed to be in, a lot of times people end up being put in positions that they’re not supposed to be in, and it causes harm to those who are underneath. And that’s where all this spiritual trauma comes in. Because a person is trying to lead from this point of view, I get these things mixed up, like the militaristic point of view versus being somebody who’s really, you know, affirming and truly humble. So the long answer again, but I hope that answers yes,
Dr. Connie Omari
yes, no. Yes, I absolutely agree. Are there any myths? I guess this theme is going to be about really church hurt and just how people can work through some of that, because I have to tell you, and this is just me being very vulnerable, having been incarcerated by the time this comes out, I will have spoken openly about it on the show. That was the loneliest time of my life. I mean, it was the most painful journey. And I’ll talk about, you know, really, the seven years I was telling you about leading up to being incarcerated. And I just remember what I learned: I was going to prison. I thought curse words were real, right? I don’t think it ever occurred to anybody out there after Scott, because I just couldn’t believe how I could be trying to serve those people if I found myself in prison. And I remember, even in that moment, God saying to me that He was so bad that it was like, I’m done. I’m done following you; I’m never going to do it. You tell me to just do the opposite, etcetera. And God just revealed it to me. I can handle that too. And I can love you through that too. And it was funny because, as a prisoner, I really kicked God out of my life. And it was almost like God was nudging me, like, Yeah, let me see you in prison, you know, without me. And then it was just like this really humbling experience. What? What I’m trying to say, Latasha, is to all of our listeners that I don’t have a heaven or hell to sit in India. Okay. But what I can say is that I am doing this thing called life without God. If it’s possible, I just can’t, and I don’t even have the words to come to my heart to speak on it. Because God truly can be your best friend. Like, he doesn’t judge, does he? He does it. He doesn’t check ever because he’s omnipotent. etc. If you can just find a way to share my experience, you might become oversharing. What’s actually good is that, as an interviewer says, everybody doesn’t deserve to know your pain. I do think that the people know that I don’t share everything; trust me, I’ll share. But the people who trust me with their lives, I believe they do deserve to know the most powerful way and most powerful resources that I know at least to help them get through adversity in their lives. That is a relationship with Christ. So growing up, you know my situation, and I don’t know what to talk about. But it was very biblical. Like the 10 commandments, I knew scripture did not have a relationship. And I just want to say that there’s nothing like the relationship that you can have. And I feel comfortable saying that even as a therapist who, like you, is trained in evidence-based practices, because God even made that.
Tasha Toney, LCSW
Me. Yes, he did. Yes, he did. And I’ve actually been a little curious here lately. I was like, This guy, Aaron Beck, created cognitive behavior therapy. So I was looking at what his religion was. And so he was Jewish. I looked up the lady who created valid therapy like puppy behavior therapy, Marsha Linehan; she’s Roman Catholic. So these are people of faith. So that’s what really prompted my wishes. And that actually, like a verse that started my journey regarding faith and mental wellness, was my own personal journey. I read this verse in the Bible. And it talked about how we cast down every thought and imagination that exalts itself against the word of God. And I was like, Wow.” So they put some things in my head that are going against God’s word that I don’t need to be thinking about. So it was more of a comforting thing than shaming, and I think there’s a difference. You know, because something I was taught a long time ago was that if you think something, you have already done it. So for years, if I thought about slapping somebody, I might as well just go ahead and slap them. Just like erroneous thinking. So I had to unlearn a lot of things. All right.
Dr. Connie Omari
All right. So, Latasha, it has been wonderful interviewing you today; you have brought a wealth of wisdom and insight to our audience. I want to make sure that if someone wants to work with you, they’ll know where to find you. So where can we send them to you online?
Tasha Toney, LCSW
Well, right now, I only have a podcast. So my podcast is called the Mindful Nuggets Podcast. They can find me on Instagram at Mindful Nuggets Podcast. That’s pretty well. I do offer a grief workshop on the third Tuesday of each month at 6:30 p.m.Central Standard Time. So that’s one thing I do have going on right now.
Dr. Connie Omari
Is that just for the people in your state, or is that all over?
Tasha Toney, LCSW
It’s actually a virtual meeting. So for anybody who wants to attend, you can just come in; you don’t have to talk, but if you want support on your grief journey, there’s a place to do that. You can actually look it up. There should be a link on Instagram, but it’s called growing through grief. So I have a page on Instagram. It’s also a page on Facebook. They’re both mindful in this podcast. Okay,
Dr. Connie Omari
Send me the link to all of that. And then I can just put it in the show notes. So when we’re watching, they can just click on it that way too. Well, thank you so much for meeting with us today. We’ve addressed some very important issues. I know our audience will appreciate this as much as I have. Thank you for coming, Latasha.
Tasha Toney, LCSW
Thank you for the opportunity.
Dr. Connie Omari
You’re welcome.