Welcome to the black Marriage and Family Therapy matters podcast where we connect black families to black therapist. On Mondays, you will receive direct therapeutic support from a licensed therapist or professional connected to the mental health field. They will provide therapeutic and educational resources to help you have a healthier relationship with your family members. On Wednesdays, you will receive direct tips and resources to help you get through the stuck places that prevent many people from having relationships with their families and significant others that they desire. On Fridays, we want you to visit our blog which can be found at WWW dot black MFT matters.com which holds additional resources and action steps that you can begin implementing immediately to improve your relationships. This is necessary because we love that you are listening. But we want you to take action to while you are there. Please grab our A to Z relationship bootcamp and be provided with the skills you need to immediately communicate better within your relationships. Please note that while the therapists on podcasts are therapists, they do not serve as your therapist unless you have signed a confidential agreement with them confirming that relationship. Thank you in advance for listening. And we hope you are inspired. All right. It’s time for the show. Here is your host, Dr. Connie Omari.
Dr. Connie Omari
Hey, hey, hey, and welcome to the black Marriage and Family Therapy matters podcast where we connect black families to black therapists. Today’s therapist is Christopher Scott, also known as hip hop social worker. Hi, Christopher.
Christopher Scott
Good morning. How you doing?
Dr. Connie Omari
I’m good. How are you?
Christopher Scott
I’m doing good. Just, you know, Friday. Awesome.
Dr. Connie Omari
It is a lovely Friday. And we are so honored to have you here today.
Christopher Scott
Yeah, I am honored to be on the podcast. Thank you.
Dr. Connie Omari
Ah, let me give my audience a quick introduction to who you are. If that’s okay. Yes. All right. Christopher Scott, is an MSW and CSWA and a social worker from Portland taking a journey to further his career and making an effort to change the platform of social work. Well, I know you and I’m sure most of us know you as hip hop, social work. Because you have this awesome podcast, why don’t you tell us a little bit about that?
Unknown Speaker
Yeah, so basically, you know, I had an idea to kind of make him a social work my own thing, you know, when I was, you know, when I was in grad school, I would see like, these people come and speak to our classes, and people would know him, like people, I love their work. And I know, I can I get to that level. So you know, and I was kind of stuck in a rut, I really didn’t know what to do. So I just found so I really, really just found out what podcasts were around the time I started the podcast. So I started the podcast, and it took me a while to kind of get like what I do with it. So like, I would like do like a short episode, I would give like, mindfulness tips, I have the feedback, I’d call a rant about trauma, racism, you know, things like that stuff on my personal life as well. But when I got to the groove of it, I started, you know, reaching out to different social workers, or therapists in general, just to kind of see what their journey is like, and what their work is, like, you know, it’s, it’s kind of see if we can build a community of people. And yeah, just trying to, like, try to spread the awareness of what social work is, and in the different areas of social work, that I try to explore. Because I know, like, at my grad school program, there was a lot of like, focus on like, therapy, you know, like, like, like, like, everybody thinks social work, think about CPS, and now, like mental health. So I’ve kind of like, expanded on what it is more than just those two lanes. So yeah, that’s really trying to make a voice in the community and help people share their platforms and things like that share tips, tips that I find valuable I share. So because I feel like if I find it valuable, other people probably find it valuable.
Dr. Connie Omari
So absolutely, yeah. Well, that’s awesome. And you’re correct. Well, I mean, I totally agree with you that like attracts like, so things that you’re going through as a black man, I mean, you might have a social work degree in background, but you still a black man. And we need you out here doing your thing. And even I’m a woman, but I think you’re on to your show as well. And I think it’s awesome. So I’m just gonna have everybody when we’re done with this. Please go look up if you haven’t already. Hip Hop social worker, and please follow this man because he’s brilliant. Thank you. You’re welcome. You’re welcome. Well, today’s topic as you know, is going to be about black men being vulnerable. And one of the things that I want to speak with you about in general, is your you know, you’re you’re actually quite vulnerable on your show. You know, you’re not like crying. But even if you did, that would be okay. Because we don’t, I don’t know, I don’t, we don’t really see a lot of that. And it’s hard to do you feel like it’s a safe space for black men to cry.
Unknown Speaker
I feel like it’s a time in place. I feel like there’s, there’s still like, kind of like, I feel like it’s still not safe, because you might have like, five friends in like, one might start crying, three might be okay with it. But if the fourth one is like, like tripping, they feel kind of like, like, kind of, kind of make the other like three like, oh, you know, sorry, I was like, I didn’t know you saw or something like that. So I feel like it’s just this little stigma of us being tough, you know, but I feel like, as we get older, that stigma shreds is you know, because because, you know, like me, I am pretty vulnerable on my podcast, but it took me a while to get there. Like, when I was a teenager, when I was a teenager, I was very guarded, because you couldn’t be soft, or you couldn’t show any emotion just because of where we come from, you know, like, if you live in a place, you know, like, where I grew up, I mean, it’s Portland. So it’s not like super, like live, but it still had a hood. You know, I’m saying, if you show any kind of vulnerability, it is major days tough, you know, because people will just kind of joke on you, or try to take advantage of you or things like that. So I feel like some of that old stigma feels follows to my new generation, which I feel like a new generation, there’s been more spaces for us to be vulnerable, but we’re not taking advantage of those spaces, you know, not quite yet. You know, so like, I work at a juvenile correctional facility. And, you know, a lot of men that I, our young men that I work with, you know, they’re, they’re hurting, you know, they’re depressed or stressed, but they don’t, they don’t ever want to tell you that, you know, like, so like, I tell one young man that I My goal for this unit is to like, have, like, healthy, be comfortable just coming back to the office, and just letting it all go. You know, so, so long story short, I really don’t have like a solid answer. But I think like, just like with generations of field a man up culture is kind of like, it trickles down, you know, it trickles down. I mean, even what, like, you know, the domain way thing where he embraces his daughter, and there was backlash from that, you know, there’s still people thinking, like, you know, like, you know, haven’t have a negative thing to say about that. Right. Right. And I just think it all stems from, you know, the whole idea of what a black man is got to be tough, you got to be strong. You gotta you got, you got to, you know, say like, you can’t, you can’t show no weakness without being being vulnerable is a weakness, but we still have some some out there that says, correct?
Dr. Connie Omari
Well, what I what I’m taking from, you know, from your actual response is that it’s not that you don’t want to cry, or that you don’t have the urges, but that you have to be cautious of society’s impact. Like, how, what does that mean?
Unknown Speaker
Yeah, for other people, if they see me cry, yeah. So like, you can be aggressive. But, you know, but you can’t cry sometimes, you know, like, you know, like, depression, anxiety and things like that, you know, like, sometimes like this. The response is to cry or it is to be aggressive, but we will rather choose to be aggressive because you know, that, that gets more of a, you know, kind of like, leave me alone response, you know, so, yes, so that will go away.
Dr. Connie Omari
You could probably cry. Yeah, yeah. You know, I mean, just hearing you speak, man, I’m getting a flashback of probably about this summer. Gosh, I feel horrible because my stepdad but he’s been in my life over half of my life, lost his sister, God bless his heart. And we were on the phone and I was just I don’t know if that time if she was deceased, but you know, she she had gone to hospice and it was only a matter of time. Yeah. And I was just expressing you know, I guess not my condolences yet, but saying that, you know, I’m sorry to hear the news or whatever. And when I tell you this 70 plus year old man, he’ll never hear this and that’s funny because I’m even cautious when we share this but he does it you know, he does. But yeah, can I the way he cried and it just it feels bad because you know, your your your schooling us now and let us know. It’s not that you don’t have the emotions, but it’s that you’re cautious of your community. But I guess when he was so overwhelmed with emotion, I honestly didn’t know what to do and I’m a therapist. 15 years into this and you Really, when I tell you, I had no clue. And it just I don’t know, it freaked me out. And it when my husband was there, thank God. And he was a I was I had to call him to me and say, Listen, you know, you have to answer take this call. And I know that’s the poor way to respond. I absolutely am completely aware of what this but you know, I really didn’t know what to do. I’d never seen it before, especially with him. And it was just weird to hear this man. All he was trying to do was express his emotions, like everyone else.
Unknown Speaker
Yeah. And I’ve had that happen before to like, you know, like, you just don’t know what to say. Or, like, you know, recently, I’ve experienced a few I experienced a few death deaths in my family. Sorry. Thank you. In Yeah, like, even even a therapist, I know that it’s, like, cry. But I still like, like, I still feel like I don’t, I don’t want to put that burden on someone else to like, take care of me. So, so I’ll fight back tears until I couldn’t find them back anymore. So yeah, I definitely understand that, you know, because you are right, like, you know, like, one of my friends are crying to me right now about the stuff that I was going through, I would, you know, I probably wouldn’t know what to say, it’s tough to be vulnerable, but it’s like, and then sometimes it’s like, you know, just having a presence of mind, you know, just to let them you know, get it out. You know, don’t, don’t rush to you know, find
Dr. Connie Omari
I’ve said that up here before, right? We don’t have to silences okay, you know, you can you don’t have to say anything, especially when someone is experienced, and we could be a loss of a loved one, it could be loss of a job, it could be loss of a relationship. Just lost right now, just feeling lost, you know, have emotions and they’re entitled to it. And, you know, we shouldn’t always feel like we should have an answer. And I will say a little bit in my defense, and I don’t know if this makes it better or worse. But I had my daughter with me. And she you know, she even though I want to teach her emotions as well. That is a lot for four year old. Yeah. I mean, also recently lost my dad and her teachers mom died. And so, you know, I was like, I don’t want my baby to just be about Yeah. It’s a hard one. Yeah. I don’t know. Okay, so you told us about, you know, working with teenage boys who have emotional difficulties, what is something that you wish that they knew about, you know, being vulnerable, and in even expressing that through crying if need be?
Unknown Speaker
That is normal, you know, that it’s like a normal emotion. I was talking to a young man last week, and he was telling me that, you know, in this environment, that we, everybody’s stressed, so like, I don’t want to, I don’t want to put that energy on another one of my friends because he’s stressed too. Like, why would I, you know, it’s selfish for me to, you know, for me to start crying, I’m sorry, venting to my friend because he has no problem. So. So, just kind of switching that mindset, you know, to like, be more trustworthy. People. We know not everybody, of course, but you know, like, don’t be so guarded. Yeah, it’s okay to be vulnerable. You know, it’s okay to cry, it’s okay. To, it’s gonna show emotion, you’re not weak, if you show emotion, you know, so you don’t have to always fight your way out of situations. It’s just life is long. You know, and I feel like they don’t see that, how long life is because they’re so young, and they like to, you know, they kind of impulsive and, you know, but, you know, no, like, life is long. And if you if you take the correct steps, and you know, it really just humanize yourself, then, you know, like, you might see better results, you know, but a lot of the youth that I work with are just like, our reacted to that there is no, like, you know, if you have a kid on my unit, you know, with the bipolar fender unit, you know, they have a lot of like stigma, they know that they’re dangerous kids. Then they also have you have you have three staff per shift. Yeah, me, the counselor, you have a case coordinator, you have the unit manager, you have the PIO, you have the lawyer, you have the court system, so they have, like, so many things that are attached to him, you know, and it’s like, if you could just kind of like break down and like just understand and just like feel that, you know, your stress is this quick on the lightning so tough and tried to be so like, you know, to say no, I’m stressed. I’m stressed out right now. So, you know, it just, it just has the, this had the ability to say that, you know, I’m stressed. I know, I do have a few kids that will do that, you know, Sam, but they’re stressed. You know, but they come into it. And they and it’s coated with like, you know, like all you know, saying like, Yeah, I’m stressed or like, you know, yeah, like, you know, like I’m tired. other place, but I’ll do a fun Memorial. Like I bought the fight everybody willing, like, you ain’t gotta go there, if you stress, it’s a stretch. And we’ll figure it out. But then you got to come in here and act like, you know, like, I’m tough and I’m bad. You know? Like, like, no, like, because any alpha nobody, you know, I’m saying. So yeah, so I would say you just kind of like, understand that it’s okay to be stressed, you’re in stressful environment, and it’s okay to just say, hey, yes, it’s absolutely so important.
Dr. Connie Omari
And what you’re saying is what I’m hearing, it really is about the impact of, of your community, your surroundings, you know, feeling safe enough. So, you know, how can we encourage black families then, to encourage our black men to express their vulnerable side, because, you know, you’re right, like, if they’re aggressive or something, we give them all types of labels, and make them feel all kinds of bad about maybe yelling, or, you know, being emotionally detached, but when they’re, you know, trying to be vulnerable, or trying to express their more emotional side? We don’t embrace that. How can we do a better job of that, and I can imagine, if we did that, then they wouldn’t spill sweets, you know, so much anger, because after a while, anybody who keeps absorbing anger and frustration and things like that is going to explode.
Unknown Speaker
Yeah, really is. It’s such a disconnect in Oregon, because, you know, like, our kids want to connect with somebody that looks like this, you know, sense of me, I’m the only person like in the facility, well, once a few people that’s like, that looks like, I might be the only black therapist in the whole agency. So it’s like, so I feel like, if there was more staff that was able to like, like, really, like, get down to their level, and like, understand their culture and things like that, then they might feel more comfortable. But right, right now, so I, you know, like these, these young males, you know, their survival mode, right now, you know, to survive. And so, you know, so, like, you know, I really, I really want to get to a place where, you know, we have groups that can come and just kind of let us and like, let it all go and not be like, or not feel judged, or anything like that. But you know, it takes time, but right now, I feel like there’s always, you know, just trying to survive and not, you know, get took advantage of, you know, so very good.
Dr. Connie Omari
Yeah, that is so true. And one of the things you kind of touched on, and I know, you know, make references to and on your podcast as well is, you know, we’re doing something as with any system, you know, you have to operate within the confines of the system. And as we know, the social work field, the counseling field, the psychology field, all of that has been built primarily on under the premises of white culture. And so then you have us kind of jump in there trying to see how we can, you know, utilize that education and that training and that resource to empower our own people making it culturally relevant and making it culturally sensitive. They, it’s a beautiful thing about like, using this type of platform to do is we don’t have to have as many conversations, you know, within, like, we can connect with them, just like we’re connecting with that with our ideal audience as well. So what would you say to someone who, really, because what I find is that and you know, I’m not trying to be racist, or whatever, but what I find is, you go into this field, because you care, like you genuinely want to make a difference. So, you know, when we, when we think about things like racism, that’s typically frowned upon. But it’s really looked down upon in the counseling field, because we’re all about relationships, and understanding human behavior and biases and all that type of stuff. Yeah. So sometimes that makes the racism that we see in the counseling and social work, avenues even worse, right? Because now, you know, they really aren’t racist because they’re trained, you know, they’re therapists, they’ve done all this work. So how can you kind of speak to the knee? Like, how can we address maybe a white therapist or social worker that might be listening to this, and really want to know how to connect with the black community, but might be having underlying racist things that they’re doing that that makes it hard to do?
Unknown Speaker
Yeah, so really, take a step back and really see like, okay, how am I helping? Like, am I contributing to the system? You know, like, am I being too hard? You know, saying because, like, I know, like, with a lot of whiteness comes perfectionism. So like, Oh, my units, you know, so they have a tag system, and basically all the fun stuff happens when your eye tag, you know, so it’s like, you got to be perfect to get to that high tech, you know, whatever, whatever but, but Anyway, you know, I’m saying like, you know, just take a step back and like really like say, okay, like, like how like, like, how am I? How am I hurting this person? Or how am I helping this person, you know, like, in my life, like I might, you know, like, am I into, you know, what their culture in their needs, you know, I’m saying like, like, do I understand that, you know, like, you know, their lifestyle might look different, you know, I know, you know, I worked in this program, and we had a well to do council to our life, you know, I’m saying in chief to make comments about, you know, like, these kids got to easy because, you know, whatever, whatever reason, you know, like, you have to do homework, you know, I’m saying, like, once a week, you name it, and he never did it. She made a comment, like, you know, when I was a kid, no, like, I had to homework every night. And I was kind of like, well, we also have horses, right? So it’s like, so it’s different, you know, I’m saying like, but you got to really understand, like, you know, say, are you holding these kids to your standards of life? Right. Yeah. Like, there’s like, if, you know, like, if I worked with a trans client or homosexual client, you know, I’m saying like, like, like, I got to understand, like, your struggle, you know, I got to understand, like, what it’s like to be in their shoes. I can’t have like, you know, the straight heterosexual lens trying to work. Right. Right. So, so I mean, I really don’t have like a complete answer for that.
Dr. Connie Omari
No, I think you answered really well, and I’m going to kind of summarize what I heard, because it’s kind of it’s stuff that I’ve been contemplating on in my head. So it sounds like basically, you don’t have to, you know, use like the N word, or whatever, to be racist against black people. And that’s what people think a lot. Well, because I’m not not lynching you. And because I’m not, you know, you and your daughters.
Unknown Speaker
I’m not racist, but that’s what makes it hard. Because you might have people that are like Trump supporters. Right, but they’re not racist. Because, you know, because they know, you know, you know, they see everybody as a human, everybody as a person, but it’s like, you know, but you like, my experience is low key racism. Yeah, no, because, yeah, you’re not, you’re not acknowledging, you know, saying like that I show up different. Right. They know, no matter what I’m showing the, you know, my skin is, you know, is a warning sign to So, yeah, you know, you’re not acknowledging that. It’s like, you know, it’s like, I mean, you might as well call me, right, right.
Dr. Connie Omari
Well, I’d rather you do it, you know, I’ve always said I’d rather be, you know, know who the kk k is than your normal, regular, everyday white person who doesn’t see color. You know, that’s, that’s a really big one for me, and I don’t want to go too far off with this. But I do think this is important, because we all need to hear this. And that is, you know, I had a really, I had a really good close. Well, I thought professional friend who was Caucasian, okay, I’m not gonna say she was a white girl. But, you know, I mean, we’ve been supporting each other. Well, I’ve mostly supported her because I was I was a contract therapist with her company, but she was making some business decisions that, you know, sometimes she needed to run it by someone, you know, I listened and I, you know, supported her, and I gave her feedback. But not only that, we have kids about the same age, we both have husbands, we both are about the same age, we’d like to say things and I mean, we’ve connected, we’ve laughed, we’ve cried, we’ve, we’ve just really shared a lot of emotional stuff. But you know, we actually terminated our friendship when I started this podcast, you know, in this work, this type of work, and you know, it just really kind of, I’m struggling with it, you know, I’ll be honest with you, because she is someone like I said, when you invest into someone Emotionally, it is hard, you know, to deal with the termination of anything. And so the fact that our, her commitment to not see in color, and how insignificant color is to her, you know, our relationship couldn’t withstand it, because, you know, how am I going to support her business? When she can, she doesn’t even believe in mine. Like she doesn’t even see that city. So anyway, I don’t want to take us away from our black man, but, you know, therapists of all colors, and all sexualities, I’m glad you mentioned that. All religions of all, whatever type of thing can be used to oppress people should really understand not only that oppression exists, but understand where their role is in that oppressive system, and what that potentially means. And that’s how you can be more effective in treating people who are yourself.
Unknown Speaker
Definitely a you got to just step back and understand that your life isn’t their life. Exactly. And if you’re a counselor or a therapist, you probably had a little, you know, like, yeah, Several more going on. And
Dr. Connie Omari
I’ve had now that’s a hard one for me. But I had to come to terms with that as well. Because, you know, I always want it to rely on the fact that I’m black, you know, I’m female, I’ve had all these things, you know, my way, but when I really look at it, like, I’m a doctor, you know, I have a PhD. And this isn’t mean to sound like I’m arrogant or anything like that, you know, I’m not, I do not think I’m all that, okay. But I have to understand that that financial class meet, that means something to like, that’s going to separate me from overall in the projects was probably as smart, if not smarter than I am, you know, with respect to how she’s been able to assess her resources. So when I’m working with a client from that population, I need to understand that she has an extra stressor on her that I’m not gonna say that I don’t have, because it’d be in black money up carries a whole nother type of type of thing. But anyway, let’s get back to black man being vulnerable. How about that? Yeah. So when you see black men struggling the most around about being vulnerable? And what can they learn from that?
Unknown Speaker
This still, like, it’s kind of a new thing. You know, like, mental health push is so new. That, that, you know, we’re just getting to a place where we can kind of be open and honest, like, you know, like, like, I feel like, my answer is probably gonna be a little bit jaded. Because a lot of the black men that I like, know, professionally, you know, are therapists themselves. So, so like, so like, they, of course, they know that they could be, you know, but to the average person, I feel like, there’s still like, stigma around, you know, like, all, you know, I still gotta be tough, it’s still like, cold being a man. So but like, but I feel like, you know, what we can learn from being vulnerable is that you don’t have to care, you know, like, you have to carry everything all day, you know, like, you can be, you can let some of that stuff go, you know, like, like, it’s not really, you know, it’s not really helping us, you know, send a carrier, you know, the stress and anxiety that we have, you know, this was holding it up, you know, I feel like it’s killing us, honestly. You know, it’s honestly, so I feel like, you know, if this having a space, we can kind of let everything go and kind of like, you know, just kind of just put everything on the table is is really like, beneficial. I know that the therapist that I connected with in Philadelphia, and he has a men’s group on Sundays, whatsoever, like, like once every, every month, and it’s just feel to the email, like, it’s just capacity, because, you know, I think stuff like men are looking for a space to do it. But it’s like, it’s not a lot of spaces for us to kind of, you know, go and have these sessions. But, you know, I do see a few more popping up, you know, I’m saying so, like, it’s good. And I kind of start winning for me, I just really haven’t had the time to sit down, and, you know, and figure it out. But when we what we can learn is that, you know, like, we’re not just rolling along. We’re not in this fight. Alone. I feel like, Todd is that like, you know, like, I feel like me growing up, you know, what I was taught was, like, you as a black man has it? Because the worst, which, which, I mean, that’s debatable, I don’t want to get into that, but I’m saying, but, but being you know, what, we don’t have to feel that burden alone. You know, like, you can lean on our friends, you know, saying, and we can have a conversation and we’re always talking about women going out and all of a sudden, they’ll say we can talk about man, I’m stressed, I need somebody listening. And you know, not having that is harmful. So I honestly feel like being vulnerable, it’s kind of it just makes your life a little bit more lives worth living, you know, because you’re not carrying it because you’re not carrying all that stress, all that burden, all that weight. I mean, you that kind of stuff your weight, you know, I’m saying like, it is you know, like, so like this summer or last year I got laid off from my job.
Unknown Speaker
Yes. And I remember that was that to me, you know, saying some time to kind of like give like, I had stages of that where I had to kind of like figure it out. But But I say that to say you know, like I was trying to carry the burden of like match. You know, the salary of what I was making them school district. So I had like five jobs. When I was contracted here, a contract and there were two parts time here. We’re part time. They’re just coming in. I remember one day I just sat down I’m like, You know what, I am not going to try to carry this burden of like being like, you know, Like the financial person in my marriage, right? Alright, just, I’m gonna take this job is gonna pay a little bit less. And I’m also doing a little bit of contracting, you know, two jobs, you know, right? Right. So it’s not really two likes, it’s one job, but like, you know, the other brother contract. So it was pretty easy. So it’s not like, stressful. So I was like, I’m gonna just, you know, if I need help, I’m gonna just rely on my system to help me if I need it. In my, let all those other jobs go, I’ll go I really, it’s been lovely. You know, like, yeah, so. So yeah, but you know, but you know, me like, holding up that, you know, like, that, like, all I gotta do this, I gotta do that. I gotta be a man, that was, you know, that was killing me. You know, like, my wife was able to see it. She was like, Man, you are doing way too much? You know? Yeah. Yeah. So I had to just kind of let it go with just, you know, just kind of open myself up to being vulnerable, you know? So.
Dr. Connie Omari
Right. So you’re absolutely right. And it’s in first of all, I want to thank you for that. Because a lot of, you know, people who are listening to you, especially black men, and can be here, you and don’t even realize that that’s what they’re doing, you know, especially from a financial perspective, because I mean, let’s be real, like men we are taught that men are supposed to provide. So when you take that would that is compromised, I mean, that is like, that’s one of the worst things you can do. You know, and so, so being sensitive to that, so when you add all the layers on top of it, which is, you know, black men are supposed to provide, but a lot of our black men are because of things out of their control, or, because of our systems and cultures don’t even get proper training so that they can provide, and then they even if they do get a good job, you know, when they become like the president or the CEO, like if they get there, you know, what I’m saying which chances are, they probably won’t, you know, because racism is real, and then they get scared that they’re gonna have extra stress and still get paid less. And, you know, all these types of things, were not really you know, and then let alone, like I said, I started with their training, but even going to school, you know, like you said, oh, boy, probably, you know, I don’t want to be too stereotypical. But, you know, a lot of times, you might have maybe one parent in the home, and that parent is responsible for four kids can’t really take the time to invest in you and with your homework. So it’s not that you or especially if you like the oldest, you might even be helping mom, take care of the three smaller kids, you know, there’s just so many different levels. And so that will impact, you know, your propensity to be able to survive. And sometimes, you know, making that quick money on the street, which you’ve seen 20 of your friends do is a lot more appealing than becoming the president of the United States, you don’t say, seen one black man, you know. So it’s a lot. It’s a lot. And, and I know you didn’t want to weigh on it too long. But I think we do get caught up in a comparison trap. Sometimes, like we’ll say, oh, it’s hard to be like rubber is the hardest to be as a black man. The point is, I think that’s even the system trying to make us think that way. You know what I’m saying? Because if I actually listened to you heard how vulnerable you were, and if you listened to me and heard health vulnerable, I was we can actually have a really strong connection, you know, we can actually really start doing some great things in the communities, but we just don’t, you know, a lot of times get the space to do that. It’s more of a competition thing. We think about black women have this black men have this, but we don’t think about it both really sucks. Yeah. Christopher, where would you direct our black men to look like if they’re in a space? You know, they know they’re not in a good space, making a lot of bad choices, dealing with some things that sometimes seem incredibly overwhelming, like racism, sexism, you know, socio economic status issues, what type of resources are available to them to tap into?
Unknown Speaker
Well, I mean, I know a lot of social media resources. So like, this page called black man, he’ll fall on the ground. Also. The melanated social work. Yeah, yeah. That, that page, they have, they have a lot of like, good things to say. And they have like, you know, and, you know, therefore, those are for black male therapists in different parts of the country.
Dr. Connie Omari
So it’s free. Yeah.
Unknown Speaker
So like, I’m really just, I mean, that’s, that’s a hard question to answer. Because like, it really depends on where you’re at, you know, saying I would like to know like, what I would do really like, if you need a therapist, and you want a black one, I really would just start with Google and type in black therapist, or a woman therapist. Right, whatever therapists you know, Google because Google like, even though like, it sounds like simple, everybody would do it. But, but but also like, it doesn’t make a lot of people don’t do it that way.
Dr. Connie Omari
Because right, so Well, let me just pause this real quickly. Because I know I haven’t even shared this with you have hardly shared with anybody, but I am trying to get the word out now. We’re actually starting a directory as well. So pretty soon if you’re black therapists just know, you know, it’s here available, come look on our website, but we’re going to I’m going to start sending like invitations out to people, you know, this is official invitation of people to join as well. So yeah, because you know, it’s important. Thank you. Thank you. Yeah, it’s important that to let people know that we’re here and we’re available. We want we want to work with.
Unknown Speaker
Yeah, sure. So you know, so you got to know that there’s therapists out there. Like you if that’s what you want everyone listen to. That’s right. Right.
Dr. Connie Omari
Be careful. Be careful. I’m telling you I have I have seriously harmed. Like, I don’t still want to spend five minutes explaining to you why I have what locking my hair. You know why I have to do that.
Christopher Scott
You don’t have more like, are you sure that was racism?
Dr. Connie Omari
I want to bypass all. Yeah.
Christopher Scott
That’s because I just traumatize me.
Dr. Connie Omari
Yeah, traumatic, traumatic. I don’t see how I was so yeah. Yeah. What are some myths, though, that we have in the black community around being vulnerable, for black men,
Unknown Speaker
that we don’t like, be affected by mental health? Like, know, that I’m mental health doesn’t affect us, like, oh, man, you know, we don’t, we don’t kill ourselves. For that, you know, like, that’s what MIT were too strong for a lot of like, I mean, it sounds good. But not sometimes when you gotta, you know, go through panic and go through things. And it’s alright, to not be strong. And ask for help, you know, are saying that we got to do it by ourselves, we can’t lean on anybody that helped. So, you know, those are the two ones that I, you know, that I’m trying to, you know, help break down. Especially the ones that were too strong for this, or that by now, like suicide affects everybody with depression affects everybody. All these things, it sounded like people, you know, that are that, you know, like running xiety Every day, and they don’t, you know, so, you know, like, I know, like, you know, I talked to like, you know, some young men that are in gangs, and they say, you know, I didn’t like they have this term, you know, saying like, I’m always on to toes, it’s like, well, that’s how it sounds like advisory.
Dr. Connie Omari
shares? Yeah.
Unknown Speaker
Sounds like me. So, you know, so you broke
Dr. Connie Omari
it down to the clinical term? Yeah. Right. Right. How would you say, You know what, I want to go to that in a second, I wanted a quick, just thinking about this, I was supervising some students who were coming into the counseling world, and they were at a school. But I remember, you know, one thing the school did was anytime there was a school shoot, that’s a whole nother issue, but the school will kind of come together, and they process and they talk about their mourning in just how difficult it was to know that these things were happening to their peers. And, you know, one of the things that the counselor was supervising brought up was that she did have a really hard time connecting with the black boys. And I just broke my heart, because I’m like, these are kids, you know, these are children. And I respect that therapist so much for bringing it to my attention, you know, because it’s when you don’t see color, and you don’t recognize it, that’s when it’s an issue. But she really did tell me, you know, how bad how hard it was for her to confront her own biases, because she thought this eight year old boy who was black, said, you know, an eight year old black boy cry was just so unfamiliar to her.
Unknown Speaker
Yeah, but it’s like, you know, we can’t, you know, you know, that well, why don’t why can’t we, you know, you know, like, why is that? You know, like why is that such a shock is you know, yes, who knows to hurt you know, yeah, because cuz you know, that is it sometimes that’s like the you know, that’s what we perpetuate is like, you know, saying like, Nah, like, you know, I don’t want to say so like, you know, some of that could be like, you know, like, you know, my kids at work. You know, it’s like a lot of us staff are scared. Like it’s like you know if you didn’t walk around here like so like on edge like you know, like if I wouldn’t be scared you double edged sword you know, I’m saying like, you know, saying they think they’re scared because they blind and they think if they asked you because I was gonna be scared. Right? Love feels like a double edged sword. Like, you know, like, I tell people, like, you have to give a little to get a little. You know.
Dr. Connie Omari
Love it. How do you think our history kind of affects the way we view black made me invulnerable by history, I’m talking about the institution of slavery,
Unknown Speaker
I feel like it affects it. Because just because, like, when everybody else was stressed, you know, saying like, the man couldn’t be stressed, you know, I’m saying, so I feel like, it was like, you might kind of have this, you know, protector role and a protector role was kind of like, you know, no, like, they shut up and work. Just like, okay, like, just go to work, don’t show the weakness. Either be the protector. But in reality that really kind of put us in a box like, well, you know, we can’t show any vulnerable babies to anyone. And also like, you know, slave mentality, just like Joe mentality. You know, what I was telling you about what the kid said about, you know, about how he doesn’t want to put that burden on his friends, because his friend is stressed out too. Well, absolutely. Imagine like biking sleds that he’s like, if you know, then when do you get to five minutes to talk to somebody? If I were just talking like, why telling me? I got the same problem. So it’s just, you know, there’s no like definite answer. But it does. It is it is complex. Yes. And I feel like, you know, like a shut up and work mentality has trickled down from generations.
Dr. Connie Omari
Thank you for that. Thank you. I’m gonna wrap it up. I just want to just ask you a quick question about a part of the show that’s called what’s good? Is that okay for you? All right. What we do at this time, is just give a hypothetical situation and I want to get your expert feedback on this. Okay, meet Lawrence Lawrence is a 22 year old black male with two children. He is single, but has had several relationships with women that have not worked out, he has noticed a woman he wants to date, let’s face it, he cannot see himself getting close to another woman with him feeling the way he did. He feels he wants to cry, often, but he knows that men aren’t supposed to cry, especially black men, but he continues to feel overwhelmed with sadness, how would you advise Lawrence?
Unknown Speaker
I would advise Lawrence that what he’s feeling is normal. I mean, but I will, like, you know, wanting to cry is normal, and it’s normal emotion. And we will try to I will really try to figure out, you know, certainly what has happened with these relationships, that is blocking you from, you know, one get close to another woman, you know, you know, it just really kind of like, helped build him up. So he doesn’t have to feel like, he doesn’t have to cry, you know, like, it really explained like, you know, you hold that in, it’s probably like you hold that in this is weighing on you, you know, say like it’s probably taking years off your life because because of the balled up in you know, saying and when you let it go, I mean, current is releasing. Yes, it is crying is really, in, its releasing whatever it is releasing grief is releasing stress. It’s releasing anxiety. It’s really the President’s release on whatever you feel, you know, fear, which leads to fear. So like, so yeah, just, you know, like, it’s like, man cries that we do not cry. You’d have everybody cries, you know, so, yeah, I would, I would just kind of, you know, try to humanizes brands. Because, you know, he’s not a robot.
Dr. Connie Omari
So, right. Absolutely. I love your feedback. And I’m sure my listeners will too. So before I let you go, can you just tell them where they can find you.
Unknown Speaker
You can go to WWE dot hip hop, social worker.com and I have all my podcasts videos, and I’ve gotten I’ve gotten into videos, like doing videos, contact information. I finally got like my first like, public speaking gig later this year. So hopefully that leads to more you know, so yeah, so but you know, I got you know about stuff that I provide a little bit about myself. Things like that. So, yeah, go to hip hop, social worker.com.
Dr. Connie Omari
Awesome. We can’t overlook that your Instagram page. Yes. Social Worker. Love it. Well, it’s been an honor today. I like so. So citing that you came on. It’s been a little bit of a journey, but you made it. And I just really am glad that you came on today. Thank you so much.
Christopher Scott
Thank you. Appreciate it.
Dr. Connie Omari
Absolutely. Good luck to you. I’m gonna continue to follow you listeners followers, please follow this man, as well. He’s got some great stuff going on. All right.
Christopher Scott
Thank you. You’re welcome. Thanks
Dr. Connie Omari
again for your time. Take care. All right, bye. Thank you for listening to this episode of The Black Marriage and Family Therapy matters podcast where we connect black families to black therapist. Since you’ve listened all the way through, come on in and join the family. If you haven’t done so yet. Please join our free community where we offer weekly trainings and more Play giveaways. We can be found on Facebook under the black marriage and families matter Facebook group. And since you’re serious about joining our family, we also invite you to join our all ad campaign, which signifies your commitment to go all in not only for yourself, but in helping us reach more people by downloading this podcast wherever you are listening to it, leaving us a review and subscribing to our YouTube channel. This really helps us reach more people and change more lives. After all, Dr. Martin Luther King once said, we can all get more done together than we can apart. With that said, I want to encourage you to share this episode with just three other people who you think might also benefit from our community, and what we are offering with the hopes that all of you can join are all in campaign. When you’re done, simply click the link all in campaign in the bio and receive a free copy of my course entitled goodbye toxicity, which is valued at $297. This course will help you to work through some of the difficult experiences that arise in most of our relationships. And it’s completely free to you with your commitment to join our all in campaign. We look forward to connecting with you every Monday and Wednesday. Thanks for listening!