Dr. Connie Omari
Hello, hello, hello, and welcome to the Black Mirrors: Your Family Therapy Matters podcast, where we are breaking toxic relationships in the black community. Okay, we have a guest here today. Her name is Sulonda Smith. Hi, Sulonda. That was awesome. What can I introduce you to in our audience today?
Sulonda Smith
Please do. I’m excited.
Dr. Connie Omari
Amazing, amazing. Samantha Smith was a psychotherapist for 27 years and is now a coach and consultant for men. Her coaching programs, courses, and life events help men solve problems and create peace. She feels honored to have coached thousands of wonderful clients worldwide. She’s the creator of communication in a way she understands. Enter the ouzo and how to create the ideal relationship with online courses and programs designed to get people out of toxic cycles, gain a deeper understanding, and communicate in ways that are meaningful and life-changing. Her vision is for everyone to have the type of relationship with mentors that helps them thrive in a personal and professional way. By mastering the art of communication and conversation, you will have fewer fights and less stress, which equals happier times and stronger connections. Wow. Awesome. Awesome. Awesome. Thank you for your work.
Sulonda Smith
You’re welcome. It’s a passion for me.
Dr. Connie Omari
I see that, you know, I really liked the fact that I just had a guest here. Oh, gosh, when did you go live with her a couple of months ago? She was also a female and was also working with men. I think that’s amazing. But if I’m just curious, what got you into wanting to work with men in a coaching program?
Sulonda Smith
A couple reasons. I have seven brothers.
Dr. Connie Omari
Do it. Where are you in the line of seven brothers?
Sulonda Smith
I’m the eldest. Yeah. So just hearing their stories, listening to their problems, and actually being able to solve them to help them with them Common ones to the most difficult, delicate lines. And then also, I’ve noticed that when I was practicing therapy, at least for the last seven years, more men came to therapy willingly, like their girlfriend or wife did not call for them and threaten them or make an ultimatum that they had some meat on their own. So that might interest you. They’ll say, Okay, they’re ready.
Dr. Connie Omari
Yeah. Good. Yeah, I think we kind of—by we, I’m just saying society—give men a hard time. Bye, implying that, you know, they might not want the hill, as opposed to maybe not having access to the hill, not knowing that help is available, or facing cultural norms that make it difficult to ask for help. What would you do? You do think that there are some barriers, and you mentioned that, you know, they’re ready. So certainly, there’s some level of resistance. That’s possible in the black community, with men. But what do you think—is the barrier making it hard from the beginning?
Sulonda Smith
Of course, it’s old-school teaching. They’re still alive. Yeah, yeah. Oh, good. Jasper. Right. Yeah. Right, all these people have wisdom, and they get to share it, but folks like Uncle Jasper, you know, or the OSU teachings coming from dad, or even, you know, heads of churches and even entertainment There are a lot of different avenues that embed in a man’s mind that he’s supposed to present himself a certain way. And only stay in that position to maintain power, like this is the underlining subconscious thought about who I should be as a band. So now that’s changing again, with entertainment, with music, and I think that’s just the shift because that’s one thing we can always rely on. It’s changed.
Dr. Connie Omari
Absolutely. The only thing that stays the same has changed. For sure. Um, so the question that we had was that you were going to answer a question that came from our community, and that question was basically how to respond to a black man without him getting defensive. I don’t know if we remember the exact terminology, but more or less. What was it?
Sulonda Smith
So yeah, you’re on it. You’re on the money. So it was, How do you respond to blackmail? insulting him? Or embarrassing him? Or insulting?
Dr. Connie Omari
Let’s kind of break that down because, first of all, yes, we want to know how to respond without doing that. Why is it wrong to do that? Or why is it?
Sulonda Smith
Okay, so I’m going to start with a ladder first. So what impact does it have to respond to a man, and in my mind, like all of these misunderstandings, that’s what we’ll call this, Sandy’s come to mind that women have about men in the first place. If you listen to Auntie Mattie, or you know, whoever nowadays has more information on social media, you don’t really understand who you’re working with. And I don’t like to say deal with. You know, in our language, we have a habit of saying, Well, how do you deal with that person? And to me, when you say dealing with someone creates an arm’s length and it creates a separation,
Dr. Connie Omari
First of all, Absolutely. So it makes it seem like it’s a burden on you to tolerate, as opposed to interacting and embracing.
Sulonda Smith
And that’s it. Dr. meiring? Is the interaction a willingness to want to interact? Because many of us don’t? We want to defend
Dr. Connie Omari
Oh, man, on the head. And it’s so funny, because I can’t speak for this person, that the question was asked in such a way that it’s like, How do I do it without offending him? as if he’s the problem. Sometimes it’s us, like the way we show up and present, who don’t want to deal with the problem either.
Sulonda Smith
It’s miseducation. I think from what I’ve learned, I don’t think I know for a fact, with my research and working with people for so many years, that it’s a set of values that we are given and that are passed on to our caregivers. So if you never learn a different way to work with somebody, to interact with someone, to communicate with them, to love them, to see them, or to embrace them, then you’re doing the same thing that your caregivers did because you didn’t learn differently. And that’s how we got to this state right now. And having generations who just interact with each other on the level of obsession, possession, defense, and separation And we can call in what happened to our people 404 50 years ago; the bottom line is that today, if you want a different relationship, you really have to embrace who you are as a person first. And then for the other person, what I’m finding, especially for men, is that because the times are changing, they’re having a hard time finding out where their places are because the old school place was to protect, before performing, provide the problem solved, right? Well, that’s a little different. Many women are doing those things themselves. So he’s like, Well, what do you need me for?And then on top of that, when what he asked for, which doesn’t sound like what we asked for, even how we ask for things, is dismissed or overlooked, he feels like there’s no investment from her. She’s not interested in the relationship or doesn’t care. And then, going back to how we interact with each other, it’s just different. Like women, when we get together, we talk about all the details we’re talking about, you know, and accidentally sprung her ankle walking up three flights of stairs with 76-inch stilettos in her pocket, that blue dress that didn’t match her strike top, right? He doesn’t want that; he just wants to know if bullets hurt. So when people ask me about men having egos, I don’t just see two different people. And maybe you agree with this too; you have someone who is overinflated, using their ego to be forceful, aggressive, and very self-centered. That means it locks everybody else out; you can be self-centered and just focus on yourself for your health too. But then you need to have another person who is focusing on just being a male. If he has to protect, provide, and perform, then he’s definitely going to show up in an aggressive way because he has to protect his territory. This is what I show and teach: is there a way to talk to his partner without bringing in all of that? In a protective mode, that sheep mode that he goes into is very different, and that’s what I mean by miseducation. So both men and women have to learn about how each functions biologically, physically, psychologically, and mentally. I love science. Yeah.
Dr. Connie Omari
I was reading an article not too long ago, and I just reminded myself about this with respect to my own seasons. Anger man taught that they can really have very few emotions, not very few emotions. It’s just that certain emotions get encouraged more than others, and especially with black men, for whatever reason, that tough demeanor is what was glamorized when Morris’s sports were immediate when we were, you know, watching TV shows sexually. I mean, they’re just considered these dominant, aggressive people. I think it’s amazing that you are emphasizing, but you know, the protective role of providing things like that does kind of change with respect to how we are in society. When I think about the emotions, though, this tie to aggression, obviously, and anger, as we know, as a secondary emotion, are typically things that are beneath that. And those are the things that we’re not talking about enough. A man can be angry, but can he be humiliated? Can he be? Can he be depressed? Can he be anxious? So we will only respond, acknowledge, or respect a man who can be aggressive and, you know, tough and strong? Are we going to give them the same respect that he says?
Sulonda Smith
Absolutely, probably not. Right, yeah, you probably want that tough, tough man, right? And they overlook the nice one that pushes over
Dr. Connie Omari
Say so. You want to be tough until he knocks you upside the head.
Sulonda Smith
because he can’t manage. He’s not designed to be yelled at. Right? We control to belittle him; he doesn’t have many men. I don’t like to say all, but many men do not have the capacity to hold that type of energy being hurled at him by her. Correct. And it’s biological, like, you know, we have lower levels of testosterone; they have higher levels, which gives them the blueprint to help, you know, be more aggressive, and all of the masculine things because there’s a difference between masculinity and femininity that has nothing to do with gender or your sex. A little more. Yeah, absolutely. So we all have a masculine and a feminine side, which has nothing to do with each other.
Dr. Connie Omari
to be very feminine like me, but have like these little face hairs, whatever.
Sulonda Smith
We have not, yeah, that’s more hormonal.
Dr. Connie Omari
Oh, that’s okay. Okay, what’s your audit? You’re right. Okay.
Sulonda Smith
So let’s take maybe a woman who, in her appearance, dresses like a male. Okay, okay. And if you watch her closely, she might even try to assert herself like a male to be more dominant, aggressive, and problem-solving-oriented. Those are masculine traits. Now, here again, I don’t want anyone to hear this, as that’s a bad thing. Because women and men have these traits, you have to learn when to use them. The feminine quality receiving its gentleness is openness. And both men and women have this: when men go home at night, they slip into their feminine nature because they have dropped the threshold of the door, the need to be aggressive, protect themselves, and make sure they remain that powerful man in the world to get things done. But when he comes home, he wants to come home and slip into his feminine nature, which is receiving love, peace, attentiveness, and respect from his partner. But when he has to bring his masculine self into his home or to this woman, he never gets to balance himself out by also being feminine. We all should be out of balance.
Dr. Connie Omari
Can you help me understand why he would have to bring that? I want to say aggressive, but I noticed you didn’t use that word. But why would he have to bring that tough person on the outside into the
Sulonda Smith
a couple of reasons. One, he hasn’t learned women. So he hasn’t learned to work with her to help her be feminine as well. She has set up shop in a hostile environment. Now men can do that, too. But she, what I find
Dr. Connie Omari
is something she needs to find all by herself. Right? But
Sulonda Smith
She has one, but she doesn’t know what to do with him. Right? So she creates a cycle. Yeah,
Dr. Connie Omari
yeah. So take off hers, either. She has a boss outside of the home. She comes home with the kids; she might need to cook, clean the house, or rub his feet in the same way as a sense of cause for me. I mean, we talked about this earlier; I believe in Christian values. But I see submission as such a strength. You know, I think it’s so. I mean, my grandma had 13 children. All right, and I don’t care how much test stuff is throwing these names out, but there’s not a man in the world who can do that, you know, you can have one, and I just, I just see that as powerful in strip, whoever, and I don’t know, I believe, and maybe I’ve gone off on a tangent. I think our society has just taken it to the place where we see that it does. And so it does, as you say, create an imbalance because, you know, we’re competing now. I want my man to protect me. I don’t want him to provide; I want him to, you know, just show up in those dominant ways. So sexy, and I love to get to be the feminine one. While at the same time, like you said, because I’m the feminine one, providing that soft, gentle place for him to be.
Sulonda Smith
I love that because you mentioned a topic that’s hot. And that’s submission. What is it? There’s subservience, and then there’s submission. Love it. When you don’t have a choice. You’re being made. You’re forced
Dr. Connie Omari
love that. Okay, just so I’m gonna tell you right now, I’m going to credit you. But I’m going to use that, yes. I’ve not been able to find the word for that. But that’s exactly what the issue is.
Sulonda Smith
Do you realize that when you are subservient, you are perceived as having less value? And submitting is a choice. So you’re submitting to a person, entity, or idea that can help you be your best and serve others. So then it goes back to her selecting the right admin. Yeah, so that’s what I mean by miseducation and misunderstanding, because of this whole separatist thing we have going on. It’s what keeps us deeper in our being, yes. And then our vision. So when you understand who you’re working with, who you’re interacting with, and that he’s not trying to purposefully torture you because he doesn’t want to have a conversation like you do with your girlfriend because he isn’t designed to because of the higher levels of testosterone, you can digress and find peace, and that is not against you. Women think men are against them. Many women think men do not have emotional intelligence. And you touched on this earlier, where they have a vast amount of emotional intelligence, even though there really aren’t many emotions. There are a couple. Right? So when she realizes that she stopped talking to him, this is a tip. When she stops talking to him, like she’s talking to her girlfriends, he will get more responses from her. If the details given to your girlfriend give him performance, he cannot maintain or contain them out here and can’t generalize. Many men cannot contain a lot of information at once; they need one note, then process that. Give them a second note. Let them process that, and then give them the last note, but I’m processing.
Dr. Connie Omari
Yeah, I can tell my girlfriend and my husband the same story. It could be about somebody having a divorce. But if I’m telling my girlfriend, it’s like, Okay, I went to the store. And I saw Janie, and I met her at the mall. And she was getting this dress, and the dress was so beautiful. And then she tried it on, and it didn’t fit or look right. You know, you go through all of it. And we get to the point where we finally go out to break. And she’s telling me about her divorce. Girlfriend. I tried to do that with my husband. He’s like, What is the what? What happened? I don’t care about the dress. I don’t care about this. I don’t care if she fits in the dress. Is she getting a divorce or not?
Sulonda Smith
Yes, you have a good tip to remember: start with the outcome first when you’re talking to me. Yes, start with the outcome. But what actually happened, and then work backwards? And if he says respect that, because he’s like and sees this and everything women don’t, he really wants to help her be happy. Now, I don’t subscribe to men making women happy. Right? She does that on her own. Every human being does that on their own. And then he gets to add to her happiness. Right? Because happiness is a state of mind. That’s my belief. It’s not sought externally. So when a man is so, I hadn’t answered directly, in a way that admits that men are egotistical because it’s their nature that I think is defined as being evil to stick, which is to protect and serve literally his woman and his family, his kingdom, his territory, his space, however he’s going to refer to it. Black men in particular, men of African descent, because of our history and how they were taught about who they are just like women, I think that that’s still encoded somewhere in the DNA because it’s passed on from generation to generation if it isn’t addressed, if it isn’t spoken about, meaning if you don’t tell him when he’s younger, you are the greatest among other great people, you know, you can do anything you want to do, regardless of who says you can’t write. I want to hug you and let you know that you are loved and valued. Others might not see that, but that’s not how you define yourself. See, these types of reminders have to be embedded in young men so that they can grow up with that concept in the back of their minds. And they’re ready for the world when the world doesn’t smile at them when they want to leave out of an elevator, clench their purses, or walk on the other side of the street if they are ingrained with who they are at a young age and told about what to look out for when they don’t get that reflection. They’re ready. They’re better; they don’t have to be so defensive. Because the world is already not in favor of them. Okay, the last thing they want to do is come home to their woman, and she will not be in favor of him.
Dr. Connie Omari
Absolutely. But what I’ve learned is that she is often struggling with her own demons or her own battles. And she’s often afraid. I think, subconsciously, a lot of times, you’re right; sometimes we probably have no clue whatsoever. You know, she was taught by her mother, who was probably struggling, probably not the best ideal situation, maybe with some financial dependence on a man who may have exploited that. I’ve seen a lot of that. Well, how do you and I know you dress with me? You specialize in working with men? But how do you address the issue of him coming home to a home with a woman who’s also broken? So she doesn’t have to? Does it? Have it? The knowledge herself? To give him that safe space?
Sulonda Smith
Yes. And I’m glad that you asked that question. I used to teach a course called Sacred Sexing Status.
Dr. Connie Omari
sacred sexy is snap.
Sulonda Smith
60 percent of women are satisfied. It taught me the three tenets: one wants to know yourself. So learn to know yourself, to understand man, and, three, how to create a partnership. So what I do for men is that I teach him about who a woman is and all the possible things she could have gone through that are now showing up at his front door that he has to now deal with. And the first concept is compassion for another human being. Period. Okay. And then we move into him learning how to not feel like she’s after him or torturing him because the bait-and-switch happens when they first start dating, and according to getting married, it’s all good. Looks good. Yes, beautiful. To
change the dynamics because in his mind, he’s thinking, What I invested in in the beginning is what I want for education. So I taught him about that. So it’s educating him about the development of a woman and what she goes through, especially when there are new things coming into her life. Like children, like work life, like managing a household, like family members, so many things over the course of her life. Thirdly, I help him manage his own awareness, competence, and who he is. That goes back to teaching young children how great they are when it isn’t working at home. And he’s now getting the tools because I believe women have a different skill set; he’s getting the tools to help her and offering an opportunity for her to heal herself so that now they can create this really good relationship. Right? That’s the goal. Now, don’t get me wrong, I wish it, but this might go against some of your audience’s principles and maybe even your own. I don’t believe in continuing a relationship that’s abusive or that says self-harming, but that it doesn’t allow, hey, look, it’s not even, I’m not even referring to Christianity. But there are some people who believe in watching Mary. So I had a client in California, and I lived in California, where I got my degree in counseling. And I had a client who was from Iran. And because she was being severely abused physically, emotionally, and sexually by her husband, they got a housekeeper. And the housekeeper was from the islands. And the husband started sleeping and having sex with the housekeeper. And the wife would not leave. And then the housekeeper got status as the woman in the house and started physically harming the mother, the wife, by the way. That’s my client. And she would not leave that situation because she said that if she doesn’t stay and if she dies without being married, she won’t be able to enter heaven. So she’d rather stay in the abusive relationship and take the chances of dying from the abuse, knowing that she will get into heaven after her life. My mom has different beliefs in our respect that my work is to, like you said earlier, work from a capacity of people who are ready to hear your message. And for her lady, my message may not ever resonate for her, but for others it does.
Dr. Connie Omari
And my biggest concern with that is that, just speaking as a therapist, I respect his safety. I mean, like you talking about to death, do you part? Oh, you’ll definitely come sooner, you know, situation.
Sulonda Smith
You know how she died; just dying itself was not as important to her getting into heaven. Her concept? Yes, that was most important. So, death was frivolous.
Dr. Connie Omari
didn’t even happen after
Sulonda Smith
The quality of her life was frivolous. It didn’t matter to her.
Dr. Connie Omari
She, whatever she interpreted in terms of the Scripture, I guess, to justify that, disregard it. What about the abundance? What about the joy? What about peace?
Sulonda Smith
Matter, her ultimate goal was that after this life was done, she get into heaven, because that life’s existence matters more than the physical for her. And that’s why I said, if you really want an abundant life here on the planet, if you’re really interested in happiness while you’re here, then you have to leave a situation that is not conducive or is setting it up for you. That’s imperative.
Dr. Connie Omari
It makes me sad. It makes me really sad. I have a question. And I don’t have nearly the expertise that you do. But, you know, when you talk about education, just tell me in a layman’s sense, does this make sense? What I have seen in terms of really great relationships—and I am talking about our relationship—is far from perfect. We have been married for 12 years. So I’ve learned a few things. And one of the things that I think helps us and other relationships that I admire is a woman who’s naturally feminine. And, you know, the squat is quoting scripture; the weaker sex kind of has a little bit of a tough edge on her. And a man who’s naturally, you know, more dominant and stronger has a little bit of a softer side. And I find that when these two come together, it seems to work really well. Because, like, I’m naturally feminine and delicate, but I don’t know, I just kind of can have a little bit of me. And I don’t know—what do you see? Do you see that? Typically, I know that sounds real, but it might sound really crazy. But oh, it’s definitely
Sulonda Smith
dynamics. And in no way do I think women should always be feminine and men should be masculine, or anything like that. Like I said, we all have these two aspects within us and know how to use them to benefit our lives. Yes. It’s a formula. So what you just mentioned is a formula. It’s those people knowing how to or allowing those aspects to come out because unfortunately, many of us are taught, like women need to be feminine, you need to be more feminine, don’t be aggressive, don’t be controlling, don’t be you know, don’t be dumb. And it’s all the masculine traits they tell us not to have; however, they are a part of us, and that’s how we get stuff done. That’s how we schedule appointments by the staff cheating us, you know. That’s how, if we’re working, that’s how we are, and
Dr. Connie Omari
That’s how we get this education. Tell with its degree. I guess the challenging thing is where do we put all that because we do need it, just like the man needs to show one thing and then come home and be one way. We as women have to do the same once they come home to be one way. And I think once we really master that, we will fully understand the value of yes. I think you really hit the nail on the head with your just acknowledgement of my lack of education or that you simply don’t know me, because I do think it goes both ways. Women are talking to women to understand men, but maybe they should talk to me to understand women.
Sulonda Smith
Yes, absolutely.
Dr. Connie Omari
I mean, he’s almost like, sometimes, you just want another man; you just want a feminine body. You know what I mean? Like you like the look in the woman that you want me to think like a man, And that’s not how this is going to work.
Sulonda Smith
The same concept that I mentioned earlier is that when women talk to men, they think they’re talking to a girlfriend. Yeah, the delivery has to be different. I’m not, no doubt, we have men who are super talkative and can hold long conversations that give you just as many details.
Dr. Connie Omari
The funny thing is the example that I gave you earlier, like if I were to tell my husband that salsa was getting a divorce, he’d want, Oh, it’s straight up. But if I’m on the phone, giving the girl the details, and going, he’ll be interested in, like, what she is interested in, but he is.
Sulonda Smith
And you know, it’s so beautiful. The way we can talk about this is because it’s definitely time for people to step out of their shells. I found that many people create these hard shells around themselves, thinking that they have to protect themselves. A person who feels like they have to protect themselves has not realized that they are the controllers of their destiny and their lives in their environments, which also include the people that they invite into their lives. We forget when I work with couples, too. Sometimes I take here and there; I’ll take some couples for clients, right? And they’ll get on there, and they’ll be bickering left and right. And you’re there. They’re talking from a position of powerlessness. And I said, Well, you know, just like you chose each other, you can choose to write, and that stops them because people forget they have options, but because they invested so much money, time, children, their hearts, and their minds into this venture by either relationship, they don’t think that they can leave; it’d be too much of a heartache to leave, but which one is more unbearable? The fact that you’re fighting every day, or the thought that this might be over and actually offer you some peace?
Dr. Connie Omari
And yes, I agree with that. I agree with that. I want to add to this, and I’m just curious if this has also come up in the black community. I wonder if we’ve gotten used to painting such a picture. You brought up the proposal of, you know, maybe ending the relationship. If it is my intention to pursue your argument further, I will do so as much as possible. There’s no abuse; I’d like to consider the option of continuing it. But what about continuing it in a way that makes it happy? Like, I think people think like the client; you were just referencing, like, if it’s bad, then it just has to be this way. This is not an abusive situation. So I would never—you know, I don’t see anything like that working out. But I do believe there are situations where people can be unhappy in a relationship and not know that they have the right to experience it; they almost think it’s normal because, I mean, we were slaves, right? It’s ever below, like, we know how to survive in very hostile, less than ideal situations and conditions. So then, when we get into this relationship and are unhappy, we don’t even think about happiness because our parents were unhappy. Everything we see on TV is unhappy. Their divorce rate is high anyway. Oh, wait, this is just what happens in relationships. Guess what? Can you speak on that?
Sulonda Smith
Yes, pain is a driving force to protect yourself. Nobody wants more pain. Most people have experienced one painful event. They don’t want to repeat it. So then they put up the defense and the wall. They’re painted versions.
Dr. Connie Omari
painted version. I love that. So how do you work because, you know, what I’m hearing you say also is that you can be in pain, you can have this thing, and then, you know, there’s another way. How do we get there because, like, when you meet someone you know at 20? And you get together, marry, stay together, or whatever, and have children at 30. You’re a different person, and that gives you a lot of opportunities to make mistakes, make bad choices, and things like that. But at some point, you know, you learn, or at least you want to learn how to do it a better way. But you’ve got this 10-year history of not doing it in a good way. And you don’t trust each other enough to, you know, know that, okay, this person, this time it happened, but it wasn’t on purpose, or it wasn’t intended to bring harm, or it didn’t really happen. It’s just a fragment of my best imagination based on the other 10 years. I mean, how do you address that, like,
Sulonda Smith
one, going back to education, and talking about what pain Is pain a thought, an idea, or a story? Okay, that stems from another experience, meaning if you were a child and your parents abandoned you, that begins a story. So now you’re in a relationship, and anything that your partner does that resembles being left or rejected, the pain comes up; it comes up to protect you from this outer shell. So looking at these particular situations from a different perspective and understanding and reeducating yourself about what pain is, where it comes from, and how you utilize it is key. It’s like what I mentioned earlier with happiness: happiness is a state of mind. And it’s not something that you receive from an external source; they can only add on to what you already have; nobody should be able to control you to that degree. The same thing is pain. Pain comes from an external source. Most of the time, although we do inflict ourselves with pain with negative thoughts, doubts, and fears, when it’s coming from someone else, looking at that from the perspective of, Oh, wait, if I’m buying into what they’re doing to me, then I must think I am, what they’re saying I am, or at least how they’re treating me, So I’m buying into how this person is treating me and what they’re saying. When you change the wording, Oh, well, you know what? What that person thinks about me is none of my business. Right? Wow, I can’t believe that person was raised to actually treat people like that, because I wasn’t. So I can’t participate in that. I don’t know; I don’t identify with that. Oh, wow, that person just called me a name that definitely wasn’t given to me. But that reflects their problems and their understanding of human interactions, not mine. Right. So when you come to the perspective and understanding of what something could be as a potential pain, you can avoid or lessen the impact after that event happens, because of course, when stuff happens and it shocks us, we’re like, Oh, it hit me in my heart. So that’s a real thing. That’s real, like the heart actually aches with heartbreak; that’s literally their science.
Dr. Connie Omari
Yes, I do believe that. integrally that.
Sulonda Smith
And when we start looking at it and breaking it down from the perspective that we are not the victim—to put it in psychology terms, that we are not the victim— And we do not have to continue to traumatize and bond with these individuals. Describe that really quickly. Trauma bonding is when you find another individual who has had the same or very similar experiences as you, and the two of you find commonality within each other, and you want to bond together over that trauma. Right? We think, Oh, that guy who told me understands me; she gets me. Well, you get each other at a pain point. But every other aspect of how you interact does not. The happy,
Dr. Connie Omari
healthy point to yes.
Sulonda Smith
Yes, you’re absolutely
Dr. Connie Omari
right. It’s normal to them. Because of what they know to exist,
Sulonda Smith
Don’t lie. So if we don’t have an opportunity to look at these situations from a different perspective, if we don’t give ourselves a chance to see ourselves in a different way other than what we’ve experienced thus far, but in what we want our lives to be, because we know that can be worked on to change that belief system, then we’ll stay stuck in what our caregivers showed us in terms of how to deal with certain situations or even what we believe about ourselves. Correct? Absolutely.
Dr. Connie Omari
So, returning to our original question, I want to make sure that we, our audience, get everything they’ve come here for. So you’ve explained why it’s important not to embarrass a humiliated man. Is there any way to get any practical tips for how we can actually respond in a way that doesn’t do it to begin with? Yeah,
Sulonda Smith
It always depends on the scenario. There are some common tips that I usually give when you’re communicating with him, like to women, and that is to ask him one question in one way, not several different ways. We have a habit of doing that. It seems like we want to feel everything; we want to feel space. But that’s not what we need to do; you ask a question once. So
Dr. Connie Omari
Is it okay? If I ask, is it okay? To ask you a question right now, like, because I think sometimes might set up the See, I just really want to know, because I want to know, is it a good time? I don’t know if you’re in your head. I don’t know if
Sulonda Smith
You’re on the third step. So yes, that is absolutely doable. It’s like, So one, you don’t ask the same question asked me one time. Hey, babe, do you want tacos tonight? Or do you want a tag? Then hold? And wait for him to answer because he might sound careless. still hold? Just wait. Because we want to feel, we want to jump in and fill in, you know, the silence. And this is actually where you’ll get more information, so you don’t have to go back and ask them the same questions over and over again.
Dr. Connie Omari
You’ll go, Oh, well,
Sulonda Smith
You know what I think about it. We had a tag on last week, and I don’t really care for blah, blah, blah. Let’s go to Taco Tuesdays. You got your answer? Well, why don’t you want to go back to the Italian place where you just told me? And you asked him; you gave them two options, and he chose one. So don’t go back and pick the option that you chose. That’s what makes men not want to engage women because they don’t know how to turn off that faucet. You know, they want to keep going. He just wants it to be over and to make a decision. And let’s just keep moving. That’s all he wants. And so when there’s something big you want to talk about, hey, I really, really would like to talk about installing a totally new kitchen. You think there’s something we can chat about? Maybe Sunday, we can step out and go get some sherbert or something like that? Would that be okay? Does that work for you? And give him a minute to process? Because he might say there will be no kitchen?
Dr. Connie Omari
The first thing I’ll say before you get questions in my mouth
Sulonda Smith
I think that’s it. That’s why I wanted to set up a time to chat on Sunday at two. So that fixes what you just said, right? Instead of him, because it gives them time to think about what he wants to say to you, men do not respond immediately, like women do to questions and accusations. They don’t like that you say women are their emotions, like little machine guns ready to fire off. Men, they’re in a well deep down. And they need time to go and get it because he’s not thinking about it. At that moment, women have a string of answers ready to go on YouTube, say for Wii U. And so you got one string. And it’s all attached at the bottom, where he got to go down there and ship through him and see which one to bring up. That’s why you pause when you ask him one question one way and ask for permission to meet with him, not permission as it is in your lesson, or he’s authority over you. But showing him that you respect his time And his thoughts when you do that when he comes to talk to you more often are not
Dr. Connie Omari
a great example to kind of support what you’re saying. My husband’s an engineer, and I’m always messing up on my computer. And when he comes to fix my computer, I’ll have like 12 different browsers open. And he just drives me crazy. She’s like, You’ve got, oh, how can you be all over here? And I was like, Well, how many of you have opened that? and he’s like, One. He’s like, If I’m on Facebook, when I’m done, I close out of it. Then I go to my email, then I close out and, you know, surf the web, or Google. But the point is, you know, we have all these different things, all these wires going at once, and he’s like, you know, one at a time. And 90% of the time, that’s really what’s wrong with my computer, too: it’s just too busy. You know what’s going on? But yeah, that’s real. I mean, that is actually absolutely 100% real. Well, I’m Susana, and I want to know, as we wrap up, what are some ways to tell me some of your resources? Of course, you tell us about your previous activities. What courses are you taking right now? Okay, so,
Sulonda Smith
You know, it’s so exciting for me because I am putting together a proxy tour for men to come together and have some weekend gameplay around their common issues. I think that’s the best way to talk about things because it’s so common, but right now, I have several courses for men and women, and you can find them at the blue zone.
Dr. Connie Omari
But I’m working; Emil linked to that, so
Sulonda Smith
I can put them in the show notes. Absolutely. And then next month I am launching again for men the course you know, to understand women, to decode them, to know what to say, how to say it, and when to say it.
Dr. Connie Omari
That’s fine until July. Yes. Because I think it was coming out in July. But we’ll make sure that we have that information in the notes as well.
Sulonda Smith
I’ll send it to you. Yeah. So I’m really excited. And I still take clients in one-on-one sessions, and then I take a few copies of clients here and there, okay, so that they know who they are in the world and what they have to offer, and then how can they best help their partners get to their greatest potential?
Dr. Connie Omari
Love it, love it. Love it? Well, I think that is pretty much all we have today. Is there anything final you want to make sure we share with our audience?
Sulonda Smith
Yes, be kind with yourself. Don’t be quick to think that your partner is trying to torture you because they don’t understand what you want or what you offer. If anything, that’s not just peace for your partner, but peace for
Dr. Connie Omari
yourself is for yourself. Awesome, awesome. Awesome. Well, you have been a wealth of knowledge. We appreciate you sharing it with us today. Yall, come check out Miss Rhonda Smith. She really knows what she’s doing. And she is available and willing to serve. Alright, thank you for your time. It’s been a pleasure to host.
Sulonda Smith
Thank you, Dr. Murray. It was a pleasure, and I appreciate whoever’s listening. I have a question. You can always email me too.
Dr. Connie Omari
All right, everyone. Thank you for your time. Thanks for joining us. Thank you for allowing us to be with you on this journey. Peace and blessings.